4 ms·

Post-secondary education is more about signalling than learning. It's more about where you got in (to an exclusive and selective institution,) and that you fini

by nickff 4y ago

Post-secondary education is more about signalling than learning. It's more about where you got in (to an exclusive and selective institution,) and that you finished, than whether they taught you anything useful. A question which might help you see this clearly: would you rather have an MIT diploma, or the knowledge you could acquire at MIT (assuming you can have only one)? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Case_Against_Education https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Case_Against_Education

foobarian 4y ago
Add to that closely knowing a bunch of other people who went to MIT (don’t discount this, think all-nighters, group projects, hellish classes etc) who could also afford it, and you got it about right.
pmoriarty 4y ago
"Post-secondary education is more about signalling than learning." Have to disagree. There's a tremendous amount you could learn at a university (depending on the school, and the student, of course). I've read many threads on HN where people (like myself) who had it easy in high school because we were naturally bright suddenly had to struggle tremendously at university because we hadn't learned how to study in high school, or because we were suddenly among many others who were as smart as ourselves and couldn't just coast. The usefulness of what you learn will vary from school to school, subject to subject, and teacher to teacher. Simply getting access to talented teachers who are successful in their fields can be invaluable. Clubs and extracurricular activities could be important too, as can networking and friendships you strike up in school. It's fashionable to bash universities these days[1], but you're really not going to get this stuff from books or videos. Not to mention the structure and motivation that classes and deadlines provide. That said, I think a lot of students aren't ready for university right after coming out of high school. I know I got a lot more out of it when I came back to finish my degree as an adult, when I was far more motivated, mature, knew what I wanted to get out of school and how to get it. [1] - somewhat justified by their outrageous fees in the US and the insane amount of debt many students are forced to take on
wolverine876 4y ago
It's such a worn argument at this point, I don't think it's worth revisiting unless you add anything beyond the assertion. I know I gained far more from what I learned than from the degree; nobody ever asked where my degree was from.
dr_kiszonka 4y ago
Maybe I am out of touch but I would certainly prefer the knowledge. Sure, a degree from MIT would help me get a few interviews but I wouldn't be qualified for any of the jobs without the knowledge.

by nickff 4y ago

foobarian 4y ago

Add to that closely knowing a bunch of other people who went to MIT (don’t discount this, think all-nighters, group projects, hellish classes etc) who could also afford it, and you got it about right.

pmoriarty 4y ago

"Post-secondary education is more about signalling than learning." Have to disagree. There's a tremendous amount you could learn at a university (depending on the school, and the student, of course). I've read many threads on HN where people (like myself) who had it easy in high school because we were naturally bright suddenly had to struggle tremendously at university because we hadn't learned how to study in high school, or because we were suddenly among many others who were as smart as ourselves and couldn't just coast. The usefulness of what you learn will vary from school to school, subject to subject, and teacher to teacher. Simply getting access to talented teachers who are successful in their fields can be invaluable. Clubs and extracurricular activities could be important too, as can networking and friendships you strike up in school. It's fashionable to bash universities these days[1], but you're really not going to get this stuff from books or videos. Not to mention the structure and motivation that classes and deadlines provide. That said, I think a lot of students aren't ready for university right after coming out of high school. I know I got a lot more out of it when I came back to finish my degree as an adult, when I was far more motivated, mature, knew what I wanted to get out of school and how to get it. [1] - somewhat justified by their outrageous fees in the US and the insane amount of debt many students are forced to take on

wolverine876 4y ago

It's such a worn argument at this point, I don't think it's worth revisiting unless you add anything beyond the assertion. I know I gained far more from what I learned than from the degree; nobody ever asked where my degree was from.

dr_kiszonka 4y ago

Maybe I am out of touch but I would certainly prefer the knowledge. Sure, a degree from MIT would help me get a few interviews but I wouldn't be qualified for any of the jobs without the knowledge.