4 ms·

spy (/spaɪ/) v., 1 : [intransitive] to collect secret information about another country, organization or person

by Lammy 5y ago

meowkit 5y ago
Is your runtime data “secret”? I think some people will have a hard time with this concept, but the idea of data being “private” or “secret”, by default, is disappearing. And it won’t be coming back if the world continues to digitize. If you want those attributes for your data, you’ll have to take measures. That means reading user agreements, verifying open source, using encryption intentionally. Vacuuming up data is not spying. Especially if you essentially agree to it when you accept the Windows terms of service (ethical issues of this aside).
- Lammy 5y ago
  > Especially if you essentially agree to it when you accept the Windows terms of service (ethical issues of this aside) “But the plans were on display…” “On display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar to find them.” “That’s the display department.” “With a flashlight.” “Ah, well, the lights had probably gone.” “So had the stairs.” “But look, you found the notice, didn’t you?” “Yes,” said Arthur, “yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying ‘Beware of the Leopard.”
DoctorOW 5y ago
"secret information" is quite a bit of a stretch...
- baisq 5y ago
  What you do with your software in the privacy of your home seems like it should be “secret”
  - Genbox 5y ago
    That is not how telemetry works. It is not spying or a privacy issue. Categorizing it as such only dilute the meaning of both terms so the real issues won't be taken serious. If you feel like a bunch of developers getting info about how many times the world clicks on a button hurts you personally, then don't install it. Calling it a privacy issue it taking it too far.
    - imwillofficial 5y ago
      It is absolutely both a spying and privacy issue. What I decide is private, or what information constitutes spying is arbitrary. I love windows terminal, but it should collect nothing by default. Another subjective opinion.
      - Genbox 5y ago
        Arh yes, the good old "everything means nothing" argument. I'm sorry to say, but words have meaning [1][2], and most of them are formally defined. And yes, I think that an HTTP POST to Microsoft's Windows Terminal team saying "UserUsedTerminalInInterative = true" is not a privacy issue, nor is it spying. Can you explain to me how this information hurt users of Windows Terminal? If it indeed is spying, it should be possible to demonstrate how it is used for hostile purposes or why such an innocuous piece of information must be kept a secret. Until then, I think it is fair for the Windows Terminal team to collect such basic telemetry for their software [1]https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/spying https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/spying [2]https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/privacy https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/privacy
        imwillofficial 5y ago
        What a low effort comment. Yes, words have meanings. Company A May decide telemetry exposes too much internal information to a potential competitor. Company B May decide that telemetry does not release anything they want kept secret. Those are subjective opinions. If I want the data to be kept secret and somebody takes it without my explicit approval, that is a privacy violation. If I don’t care, it’s not. Same thing with spying. If I deem it a secret, it is now spying to take it from me.

spy (/spaɪ/) v., 1 : [intransitive] to collect secret information about another country, organization or person

by Lammy 5y ago

spy (/spaɪ/) v., 1 : [intransitive] to collect secret information about another country, organization or person

Is your runtime data “secret”? I think some people will have a hard time with this concept, but the idea of data being “private” or “secret”, by default, is disappearing. And it won’t be coming back if the world continues to digitize. If you want those attributes for your data, you’ll have to take measures. That means reading user agreements, verifying open source, using encryption intentionally. Vacuuming up data is not spying. Especially if you essentially agree to it when you accept the Windows terms of service (ethical issues of this aside).

Lammy 5y ago
> Especially if you essentially agree to it when you accept the Windows terms of service (ethical issues of this aside) “But the plans were on display…” “On display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar to find them.” “That’s the display department.” “With a flashlight.” “Ah, well, the lights had probably gone.” “So had the stairs.” “But look, you found the notice, didn’t you?” “Yes,” said Arthur, “yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying ‘Beware of the Leopard.”

DoctorOW 5y ago

"secret information" is quite a bit of a stretch...

baisq 5y ago
What you do with your software in the privacy of your home seems like it should be “secret”
- Genbox 5y ago
  That is not how telemetry works. It is not spying or a privacy issue. Categorizing it as such only dilute the meaning of both terms so the real issues won't be taken serious. If you feel like a bunch of developers getting info about how many times the world clicks on a button hurts you personally, then don't install it. Calling it a privacy issue it taking it too far.
  - imwillofficial 5y ago
    It is absolutely both a spying and privacy issue. What I decide is private, or what information constitutes spying is arbitrary. I love windows terminal, but it should collect nothing by default. Another subjective opinion.
    - Genbox 5y ago
      Arh yes, the good old "everything means nothing" argument. I'm sorry to say, but words have meaning [1][2], and most of them are formally defined. And yes, I think that an HTTP POST to Microsoft's Windows Terminal team saying "UserUsedTerminalInInterative = true" is not a privacy issue, nor is it spying. Can you explain to me how this information hurt users of Windows Terminal? If it indeed is spying, it should be possible to demonstrate how it is used for hostile purposes or why such an innocuous piece of information must be kept a secret. Until then, I think it is fair for the Windows Terminal team to collect such basic telemetry for their software [1]https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/spying https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/spying [2]https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/privacy https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/privacy
      - imwillofficial 5y ago
        What a low effort comment. Yes, words have meanings. Company A May decide telemetry exposes too much internal information to a potential competitor. Company B May decide that telemetry does not release anything they want kept secret. Those are subjective opinions. If I want the data to be kept secret and somebody takes it without my explicit approval, that is a privacy violation. If I don’t care, it’s not. Same thing with spying. If I deem it a secret, it is now spying to take it from me.