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> It was probably meant to protect to right of the people to engage in a violent revolution when required, and enacted by people who had literally done so to cr
by kodah 4y ago
> It was probably meant to protect to right of the people to engage in a violent revolution when required, and enacted by people who had literally done so to create the United States.
This is how I learned 2A. More or less, no government can last forever and at some point governments will need to be overthrown and set anew. Sound familiar?
> We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.
They even provided some basic criteria for when might be a good time:
> Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.
I was taught that 2A was the tool that ensures that this section of the Declaration of Independence would still be relevant to their new government.
- cjsplat 4y agoIf you believe this, does the 2A give people individual rights to own tanks, missiles, nukes, chemical weapons? If not, why? Where are the limits in the constitution on the types of arms a person can own? This is especially relevant if the goal of the 2S is to be able to stand up to the US armed forces. Or is it your view that the goal of the 2A is for a poorly armed mob to be able to rise up in collective suicide against better armed better trained government forces?
- briHass 4y ago> Or is it your view that the goal of the 2A is for a poorly armed mob to be able to rise up in collective suicide against better armed better trained government forces? You need to define the hypothetical 'sides' here a little better. Is this armed mob fighting for principles that many members of the 'government forces' agree with? Would this government force be willing to kill large numbers of their neighbors and fellow countrymen? A surprisingly effective resistance can be made by an outnumbered/outgunned 'mob', assuming they have some basic weapons. Home field advantage and guerrilla warfare go pretty far. See: Vietnam, Afghanistan, Ukraine.
- cjsplat 4y agoTalk to Kodah above about his fantasy league of rebellion. I believe the militia clause actually means state level armed service, such as was common in the various states at the time.
- kodah 4y agoYou and I actually believe the same thing, I just believe 2A is linked to early militias, and in the event that there were infighting in the US that early component would be needed again. I also believe 2A reinforces state power with respect to federal power, and balancing them is important. You on the other hand are an egotistical ass with 220 karma and behavior to boot.
- cjsplat 4y agoAs a follow up - If Vietnam, Afghanistan, and Ukraine are related to the 2nd Amendment necessary rebellion theory, then the implication is that the insurgent weapons in those wars are covered by the 2A. Very interesting. A personal right to fully automatic weapons, SAMs, tanks, anti-tank, etc. Yeah, I don't think so. Militia is used 6 times in the Constitution and collected amendments. I tend to think that it means the same thing in the 2A as in the 5 places.
- tablespoon 4y ago> If you believe this, does the 2A give people individual rights to own tanks, missiles, nukes, chemical weapons? Yawn. But I suppose you want an answer, so how about this: infantry weapons that a regular citizen can reasonably afford and practice with (i.e. shoot on a regular basis). So military-style automatic rifles, machine guns, etc.