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> enrollment management What would be a comparable industry perspective to the way colleges fight over tuition generators (students)? Oil companies fighting ov

> enrollment management What would be a comparable industry perspective to the way colleges fight over tuition generators (students)? Oil companies fighting over oil fields?

nsv 4y ago
Any industry which has clients that pay for a service, I guess.
- astrange 4y ago
  The difference is that (some) colleges are also motivated to get you to apply so they can reject you, because it makes them look more exclusive.
  - newsclues 4y ago
    Don't some financial service businesses operate on similar principals.
    - astrange 4y ago
      Like Amex Centurion cards? They're definitely exclusive (or fake-exclusive) but I haven't seen them actually advertise rejection rates like colleges sometimes do.
cheriot 4y ago
Large purchase, most customers choose one and leave the market, many possible consumers, seasonal. Residential solar or real estate agents? The crazy thing to me about higher ed is that there's large loans and everybody qualifies. We'd probably get a better skills/job match by including the major in interest rate calculations.
- nanidin 4y ago
  > We'd probably get a better skills/job match by including the major in interest rate calculations. This brings up the hairy issue that all education should not be focused on eventual income generation. We still need our English, History, and other majors out there in the real world even if we don't expect them to make a great ROI on their degrees. Their contributions to society are still worthwhile. I think a policy that incorporates the major into the interest rate would drive universities to cut less profitable programs, and MAYBE lower tuition for those majors. I think my approach to change the system would be to put a cap on the maximum loan that the government will back, and have that cap be influenced by major. This would be similar to the conventional loan situation for mortgages.
  - cheriot 4y ago
    > We still need our English, History, and other majors out there in the real world even if we don't expect them to make a great ROI on their degrees. I agree, but getting them from an expensive private school is a luxury. > I think my approach to change the system would be to put a cap on the maximum loan that the government will back, and have that cap be influenced by major. This would be similar to the conventional loan situation for mortgages. Some kind of cap is a really good idea. Especially if that means state schools are covered, but not the entire 80k/year of a private one. The way student loans are difficult to discharge in bankruptcy means a lot of kids make a mistake they'll spend the rest of their life trying to get away from.
  - scarface74 4y ago
    > This brings up the hairy issue that all education should not be focused on eventual income generation. Why would anyone in the middle or lower income class spend money on a college degree that was not geared toward increasing their income? There is a reason that journalism graduates predominantly come from wealthy families.
    - nanidin 4y ago
      There are legions of starving artists that are probably better qualified to answer that than me :)
Loughla 4y ago
Marketing pepsi versus coke maybe? It's all sales if you boil it down (sadly). Actually, in my opinion, one of the main problems in higher education today is that the value proposition of the actual education and student experience is secondary to the ability to market. In other words, new programs are presented by faculty (or rarely staff because of politics) and administration will immediately ask how this can be sold to increase enrollment (read: revenue). In other words, what is best for students, in terms of experience and employment outcomes, will always take a backseat to what is flashy and looks good in a brochure.
- shuntress 4y ago
  Well that is the problem with everything, right? When Profit is the system's main incentive, it can be easy for decision makers to start viewing "profit" as an input rather than an output.
newsclues 4y ago
Education is a unique industry and market on to itself. I worked in a part of it, and edu is just different than real business. You have government funding, both for research and education. You have tuition and fees, which students pay but there are student loans and grants etc. You have endowments. You have alumni and donor funding. You have schools that develop technology and own profitable patents. Sports is its own topic that I don't know enough about to comment on.
kansface 4y ago
Oil wells last more than 4 years. Most of these colleges have effectively no endowment and not close to enough state funding. Maybe leasing cars or code boot camps?

> enrollment management What would be a comparable industry perspective to the way colleges fight over tuition generators (students)? Oil companies fighting over oil fields?

nsv 4y ago

Any industry which has clients that pay for a service, I guess.

astrange 4y ago
The difference is that (some) colleges are also motivated to get you to apply so they can reject you, because it makes them look more exclusive.
- newsclues 4y ago
  Don't some financial service businesses operate on similar principals.
  - astrange 4y ago
    Like Amex Centurion cards? They're definitely exclusive (or fake-exclusive) but I haven't seen them actually advertise rejection rates like colleges sometimes do.

cheriot 4y ago

Large purchase, most customers choose one and leave the market, many possible consumers, seasonal. Residential solar or real estate agents? The crazy thing to me about higher ed is that there's large loans and everybody qualifies. We'd probably get a better skills/job match by including the major in interest rate calculations.

nanidin 4y ago
> We'd probably get a better skills/job match by including the major in interest rate calculations. This brings up the hairy issue that all education should not be focused on eventual income generation. We still need our English, History, and other majors out there in the real world even if we don't expect them to make a great ROI on their degrees. Their contributions to society are still worthwhile. I think a policy that incorporates the major into the interest rate would drive universities to cut less profitable programs, and MAYBE lower tuition for those majors. I think my approach to change the system would be to put a cap on the maximum loan that the government will back, and have that cap be influenced by major. This would be similar to the conventional loan situation for mortgages.
- cheriot 4y ago
  > We still need our English, History, and other majors out there in the real world even if we don't expect them to make a great ROI on their degrees. I agree, but getting them from an expensive private school is a luxury. > I think my approach to change the system would be to put a cap on the maximum loan that the government will back, and have that cap be influenced by major. This would be similar to the conventional loan situation for mortgages. Some kind of cap is a really good idea. Especially if that means state schools are covered, but not the entire 80k/year of a private one. The way student loans are difficult to discharge in bankruptcy means a lot of kids make a mistake they'll spend the rest of their life trying to get away from.
- scarface74 4y ago
  > This brings up the hairy issue that all education should not be focused on eventual income generation. Why would anyone in the middle or lower income class spend money on a college degree that was not geared toward increasing their income? There is a reason that journalism graduates predominantly come from wealthy families.
  - nanidin 4y ago
    There are legions of starving artists that are probably better qualified to answer that than me :)

Loughla 4y ago

Marketing pepsi versus coke maybe? It's all sales if you boil it down (sadly). Actually, in my opinion, one of the main problems in higher education today is that the value proposition of the actual education and student experience is secondary to the ability to market. In other words, new programs are presented by faculty (or rarely staff because of politics) and administration will immediately ask how this can be sold to increase enrollment (read: revenue). In other words, what is best for students, in terms of experience and employment outcomes, will always take a backseat to what is flashy and looks good in a brochure.

shuntress 4y ago
Well that is the problem with everything, right? When Profit is the system's main incentive, it can be easy for decision makers to start viewing "profit" as an input rather than an output.

newsclues 4y ago

Education is a unique industry and market on to itself. I worked in a part of it, and edu is just different than real business. You have government funding, both for research and education. You have tuition and fees, which students pay but there are student loans and grants etc. You have endowments. You have alumni and donor funding. You have schools that develop technology and own profitable patents. Sports is its own topic that I don't know enough about to comment on.

kansface 4y ago

Oil wells last more than 4 years. Most of these colleges have effectively no endowment and not close to enough state funding. Maybe leasing cars or code boot camps?