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I'll tell you straight up, right now, that the parent poster is correct. I, like you, tend to roll my eyes at the "everyone should work in <xyz>" proclamations

I'll tell you straight up, right now, that the parent poster is correct. I, like you, tend to roll my eyes at the "everyone should work in <xyz>" proclamations, but the parent is correct. Nothing goes right in a busy kitchen. Every assumption you might have about your upcoming shift is thrown out the window. A busy kitchen is absolutely a meritocracy. There's no racism, no views on drugs and alcohol. You are 2 secs away from lighting your hair on fire, or stepping in a boiling vat of water or grease and headed to the urgent care. You'll learn fast about being on the bottom, on the top, leadership, procrastination, laziness, scheduling, stock, product, financials, you name it.

paxys 4y ago
What about a doctor performing an hours long life saving surgery? A soldier on the front lines in a warzone literally dodging bullets? An accountant in the middle tax season? A lawyer fighting a case where failure could mean death? An engineer fixing a production issue with millions of users angrily knocking at your door? Competing in the finals of a sporting event? A nurse assisting covid patients not knowing if they'd be affected next? A schoolteacher herding a class full of rowdy kids every day? None of these jobs are easy or predictable. A majority of jobs in the world require everything you said to be successful. Working in a kitchen might be hard but is hardly unique.
- sixstringtheory 4y ago
  I often say "everyone should wait tables once in their lives." I think that encapsulates most of the things people are saying about BOH work, but also includes actually needing to make people happy (I've worked BOH and FOH extensively, and successfully at both; you don't have to make anyone happy from BOH–except chef–to be successful, but FOH you literally depend on it if most of your income is from tips). The reason I agree with the statement about working in a service job as opposed to all of the other examples you've listed is that the lessons learned in a service job are widely applicable to everyday life and interactions with everyday people. No doubt, you will learn a lot about yourself being on the front lines of war, but you can't take those lessons back to deal with the variety of people you'll interact with day to day in normal society. In fact, it may be counterproductive to try that. Likewise, rarely will people need the specific skills required to perform hours-long lifesaving surgery in their day to day life. True, it may come up, but that is extraordinary. You might as well also start building a doomsday bunker in your backyard.
  - 0des 4y ago
    a simple skill tree: software sales -> FOH software dev -> BOH
- SideburnsOfDoom 4y ago
  > What about a doctor .. soldier ... accountant ... lawyer .. engineer ... athete .. teacher. I think that if you want to say ""everyone should experience xyz" then it should be both a) instructive to all and b) accessible to all. This rules out anything with years of training required. So, working in a kitchen is clearly far more accessible to "everyone" than the others. The bar to entry is far lower. You don't need a study program before you can wash dishes. If you can walk in, do the hard work for long hours and low pay then you're in, they need that and the rest doesn't matter. I think that's what parent poster means by "A busy kitchen is absolutely a meritocracy".
  - ethbr0 4y ago
    Of the top of my head, kitchen and construction are the only universally available jobs that will take you without any educational or criminal record requirements.
- wildmanx 4y ago
  While working any of these jobs will teach and grow you a lot, I would argue that most of them deal with entirely man-made preventable problems. A kitchen being too tight and too hot is not a law of nature. It could be built with more space and better ventilation. Sure that costs more, but why are we accepting shitty work conditions just to save a buck? The shifts being 10 hours 7 days a week is not a law of nature. Hire 2 people instead with proper shift scheduling. Oh that's more expensive? Well, that's what it actually costs. It's just that your 7x10 hour chef stomachs that extra cost right now, driving them into drugs and alcohol, see the original article we're discussing here. And similar arguments can be drawn for the other examples. Accountant in the middle of tax season? Start preparing taxes earlier. Nothing accounting does is sudden and unexpected. It's accumulated over a whole year. It's the accountant's (or client's) fault if that suddenly all needs to be taken care of last second. Engineer fixing a production issue for millions of users? Get designs and routines in place that let you sleep well at night, with redundancy, automation, testing. A soldier on the front lines? Prevent wars from breaking out in the first place. A class full of rowdy kids at school? Terrible school system, and society approves with "it is what it is", don't even get me started. With very few exceptions all those problems are home made. It teaches good lessons to experience them, but the main take away should be how to prevent them in the first place.

paxys 4y ago

What about a doctor performing an hours long life saving surgery? A soldier on the front lines in a warzone literally dodging bullets? An accountant in the middle tax season? A lawyer fighting a case where failure could mean death? An engineer fixing a production issue with millions of users angrily knocking at your door? Competing in the finals of a sporting event? A nurse assisting covid patients not knowing if they'd be affected next? A schoolteacher herding a class full of rowdy kids every day? None of these jobs are easy or predictable. A majority of jobs in the world require everything you said to be successful. Working in a kitchen might be hard but is hardly unique.

sixstringtheory 4y ago
I often say "everyone should wait tables once in their lives." I think that encapsulates most of the things people are saying about BOH work, but also includes actually needing to make people happy (I've worked BOH and FOH extensively, and successfully at both; you don't have to make anyone happy from BOH–except chef–to be successful, but FOH you literally depend on it if most of your income is from tips). The reason I agree with the statement about working in a service job as opposed to all of the other examples you've listed is that the lessons learned in a service job are widely applicable to everyday life and interactions with everyday people. No doubt, you will learn a lot about yourself being on the front lines of war, but you can't take those lessons back to deal with the variety of people you'll interact with day to day in normal society. In fact, it may be counterproductive to try that. Likewise, rarely will people need the specific skills required to perform hours-long lifesaving surgery in their day to day life. True, it may come up, but that is extraordinary. You might as well also start building a doomsday bunker in your backyard.
- 0des 4y ago
  a simple skill tree: software sales -> FOH software dev -> BOH
SideburnsOfDoom 4y ago
> What about a doctor .. soldier ... accountant ... lawyer .. engineer ... athete .. teacher. I think that if you want to say ""everyone should experience xyz" then it should be both a) instructive to all and b) accessible to all. This rules out anything with years of training required. So, working in a kitchen is clearly far more accessible to "everyone" than the others. The bar to entry is far lower. You don't need a study program before you can wash dishes. If you can walk in, do the hard work for long hours and low pay then you're in, they need that and the rest doesn't matter. I think that's what parent poster means by "A busy kitchen is absolutely a meritocracy".
- ethbr0 4y ago
  Of the top of my head, kitchen and construction are the only universally available jobs that will take you without any educational or criminal record requirements.
wildmanx 4y ago
While working any of these jobs will teach and grow you a lot, I would argue that most of them deal with entirely man-made preventable problems. A kitchen being too tight and too hot is not a law of nature. It could be built with more space and better ventilation. Sure that costs more, but why are we accepting shitty work conditions just to save a buck? The shifts being 10 hours 7 days a week is not a law of nature. Hire 2 people instead with proper shift scheduling. Oh that's more expensive? Well, that's what it actually costs. It's just that your 7x10 hour chef stomachs that extra cost right now, driving them into drugs and alcohol, see the original article we're discussing here. And similar arguments can be drawn for the other examples. Accountant in the middle of tax season? Start preparing taxes earlier. Nothing accounting does is sudden and unexpected. It's accumulated over a whole year. It's the accountant's (or client's) fault if that suddenly all needs to be taken care of last second. Engineer fixing a production issue for millions of users? Get designs and routines in place that let you sleep well at night, with redundancy, automation, testing. A soldier on the front lines? Prevent wars from breaking out in the first place. A class full of rowdy kids at school? Terrible school system, and society approves with "it is what it is", don't even get me started. With very few exceptions all those problems are home made. It teaches good lessons to experience them, but the main take away should be how to prevent them in the first place.