5 ms·

Also the Disposition Matrix https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disposition_Matrix https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disposition_Matrix

by Tao332 4y ago

xvector 4y ago
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- teawrecks 4y ago
  We are in charge of protecting our country. We choose who does it, and should hold those who don't do it appropriately accountable.
  - xvector 4y ago
    And the Disposition Matrix has been hailed as an extremely effective component with regards to protecting our country. It does not target US citizens, so there isn't really any concern here.
    - Tao332 4y ago
      > It does not target US citizens, so there isn't really any concern here. Ah, sorry I didn't catch the Socratic Irony you were employing until you served up this meatball. This is the part where the interlocutor points out "but the first time most of us even heard about the Disposition Matrix was when it was used against Anwar al-Alwaki -- a US citizen!"
      - xvector 4y ago
        Maybe it's just me, but I'm fine with your citizenship rights being revoked when you plot to kill foreigners and join Al-Qaeda and become a commander of a terrorist organization.
- nitwit005 4y ago
  Even the people who are directly in charge of protecting the country have raised concerns about this.
  - xvector 4y ago
    Reading the article, the opposite is mentioned - almost every leader that has come across the program has praised its effectiveness and has called it an "easy decision."
- _dain_ 4y ago
- icambron 4y ago
  We’re not in an armchair. This is our country; they’re responsible to us.
  - sfe22 4y ago
    That is just in popular culture. In theory and reality, there in no need for your or any other American’s blessing for the feds, congress, president or even judges to exist and have power.
    - icambron 4y ago
      This is moving the goalposts: "it's inappropriate for you to have an opinion" vs "you are a powerless peon, so ha". Also, I don't know what you mean by "in theory"; government by the people is very much the basis of government here.
      - sfe22 4y ago
        It mentions “by the people” however the roles and the power exists without people’s continued consent, which makes the words worthless.
  - xvector 4y ago
    And they are responsible for protecting us too. They have far more information and understanding regarding our enemies than we could ever have. What makes you think that you could possibly be qualified to comment on the necessity and efficacy of the program when you lack the experience and day-to-day responsibilities that they have? Would you trust grandma with cybersecurity? It's the same principle here. No one here knows anything about national security and defense, so maybe we should stop judging programs that have been deemed to be extraordinarily effective when deployed against (non-citizen) enemies of state. Obviously, the discussion gets a bit thornier when citizens are involved, but that is not the case here.
    - raxxorraxor 4y ago
      Better be thorough with that or maybe such things make people want to bomb a high rise or two. Cynical yes, but a realistic consequence of ideas like that. The career as a lawyer didn't seem to influence Obama on this decision very much.
- Tao332 4y ago

Also the Disposition Matrix https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disposition_Matrix https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disposition_Matrix

by Tao332 4y ago

Also the Disposition Matrix https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disposition_Matrix https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disposition_Matrix

xvector 4y ago

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
teawrecks 4y ago
We are in charge of protecting our country. We choose who does it, and should hold those who don't do it appropriately accountable.
- xvector 4y ago
  And the Disposition Matrix has been hailed as an extremely effective component with regards to protecting our country. It does not target US citizens, so there isn't really any concern here.
  - Tao332 4y ago
    > It does not target US citizens, so there isn't really any concern here. Ah, sorry I didn't catch the Socratic Irony you were employing until you served up this meatball. This is the part where the interlocutor points out "but the first time most of us even heard about the Disposition Matrix was when it was used against Anwar al-Alwaki -- a US citizen!"
    - xvector 4y ago
      Maybe it's just me, but I'm fine with your citizenship rights being revoked when you plot to kill foreigners and join Al-Qaeda and become a commander of a terrorist organization.
nitwit005 4y ago
Even the people who are directly in charge of protecting the country have raised concerns about this.
- xvector 4y ago
  Reading the article, the opposite is mentioned - almost every leader that has come across the program has praised its effectiveness and has called it an "easy decision."
_dain_ 4y ago
icambron 4y ago
We’re not in an armchair. This is our country; they’re responsible to us.
- sfe22 4y ago
  That is just in popular culture. In theory and reality, there in no need for your or any other American’s blessing for the feds, congress, president or even judges to exist and have power.
  - icambron 4y ago
    This is moving the goalposts: "it's inappropriate for you to have an opinion" vs "you are a powerless peon, so ha". Also, I don't know what you mean by "in theory"; government by the people is very much the basis of government here.
    - sfe22 4y ago
      It mentions “by the people” however the roles and the power exists without people’s continued consent, which makes the words worthless.
- xvector 4y ago
  And they are responsible for protecting us too. They have far more information and understanding regarding our enemies than we could ever have. What makes you think that you could possibly be qualified to comment on the necessity and efficacy of the program when you lack the experience and day-to-day responsibilities that they have? Would you trust grandma with cybersecurity? It's the same principle here. No one here knows anything about national security and defense, so maybe we should stop judging programs that have been deemed to be extraordinarily effective when deployed against (non-citizen) enemies of state. Obviously, the discussion gets a bit thornier when citizens are involved, but that is not the case here.
  - raxxorraxor 4y ago
    Better be thorough with that or maybe such things make people want to bomb a high rise or two. Cynical yes, but a realistic consequence of ideas like that. The career as a lawyer didn't seem to influence Obama on this decision very much.
Tao332 4y ago