8 ms·

I live in Seattle and have been depressed for a while. I had my Vitamin D3 levels checked via blood test, and they were really low. Started taking 5,000 IU per

I live in Seattle and have been depressed for a while. I had my Vitamin D3 levels checked via blood test, and they were really low. Started taking 5,000 IU per day, and I feel exactly the same as before.

numinoid 5y ago
Anecdotally, I had to bump up to 10,000 IU to see a difference.
civilized 5y ago
In this and the GP we have Vitamin D and depression in a nutshell.
mupuff1234 5y ago
Did you do another blood test to check if the levels changed?
trash3 5y ago
Check your diet. Just because you take vitamin d supplements doesn't mean it gets absorbed into your bloodstream.
tomatowurst 5y ago
5000 IU is really too much. At best 2000, 2500 IU is good.
- dralley 5y ago
  5000 isn't too much when you're catching up from a deficiency.
  - BenjiWiebe 5y ago
    I took 15k IU daily (at the advice of my doctor) for several months at one point to get my levels back up. I don't remember the numbers, but my levels were extremely low.
- Vecr 5y ago
  No, 5000 IU per day is generally considered the highest non megadose. Make sure it is good quality (D3, USP in the US), and it should be fine. Some people say also to take K2 (also make sure it's USP in the US), but I'm not sure the exact supposed mechanism of protection from adverse effects from D3. Something about preventing calcium from leaching from the bones and accumulating in the blood, I think.
  - pmoriarty 5y ago
    "Vitamin D controls the absorption of calcium into the blood. Vitamin K2 controls where that calcium ends up. "Over-supplementation of vitamin D3 without ample vitamin K2 leads to problems of excess calcium. "If calcium isn’t laid into bone, it will find itself in other tissues, like your arteries. Calcium in the arteries is BAD. It contributes to atherosclerosis and vessel stiffness." https://dralexrinehart.com/articles/the-vitamin-d-and-vitamin-k2-connection-understanding-the-mechanisms-what-to-test-and-how-much-d3-and-k2-to-take/ https://dralexrinehart.com/articles/the-vitamin-d-and-vitami...
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
- mountainriver 5y ago
  It really depends on the person. You just need to monitor your blood levels
- LinuxBender 5y ago
  I use 60,000 to 90,000 IU's per day and have been doing so for years. The most I have taken in a 24 hour period is 140,000 IU's. There is no way I could have started off at those levels however. It would have induced major hypercalcemia had I done that prior to mobilizing all the stored/misplaced calcium in my gut and vasculature. I am not suggesting anyone else do this. One must have a specific need when doing this. I only mention this to say that one can go well above the RDA/RDI that are highly contested to be far too low for modern diets, environmental inputs and lifestyles.
  - TameAntelope 5y ago
    > Taking 60,000 international units (IU) a day of vitamin D for several months has been shown to cause toxicity. This level is many times higher than the U.S. Recommended Dietary Allowance (RDA) for most adults of 600 IU of vitamin D a day. [0] I think you may be poisoning yourself. [0] https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/nutrition-and-healthy-eating/expert-answers/vitamin-d-toxicity/faq-20058108 https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/nutrition-and-h...
    - LinuxBender 5y ago
      That would certainly be true had I done that from day one as I had mentioned. Their documentation as with most medical documentation is based on the lowest common denominators. They will not risk explaining why one might do what I am doing.
      - TameAntelope 5y ago
        It seems true without qualification. What you're saying here has a lot in common with "woo", I hope you realize.
        LinuxBender 5y ago
        I suppose time will tell. I've been doing this a number of years. I will check back in a few more years to see how things are going. Honestly the cholecalciferol levels are the least taboo of the biohacking I do with myself. The more risky testing I did was to see how high I could go on the tocotrienols, tocopherols and fibrinolytic enzymes before I ran into bleeding.
- dragonwriter 5y ago
  Unless you are a doctor that has been monitoring the poster, you have no idea if that is true. My blood levels are consistently deficient when I’m not taking 10,000 IU/day (and this is with a fair amount of daily sun exposure.) People have widely varying needs.
cashsterling 5y ago
It can take a while for your Vit-D levels to rise, even with supplementing 5k IU per day... I would check your levels again. And, of course, Vit-D is not the only contributor to depression so it might be good to see a GP and/or get a general blood panel done.
olah_1 5y ago
I have never felt an affect from oral vitamins in any situation. Sitting in the sun however seems to do more than just “increase vitamin d levels”. The sensation is just overwhelmingly lovely. It seems to reduce cortisol, makes you feel tired in a euphoric way. Animals love to warm their fur in shafts of sunlight too. Perhaps we should be thinking more in terms of joyful activities in general and less trying to biohack.
- hnick 5y ago
  Yes sunlight makes me extremely tired, like if I go for a walk or a picnic or something I'll end up far more exhausted than anything else can explain. I wonder if it's some kind of overcompensating effect due to my typical lack of it.
- __ryan__ 5y ago
  That narrative might work for you, but the bio-hack narrative might work for others. Maybe the takeaway is to go into things with a positive attitude but also take a personal inventory and adapt if something that is supposed to work doesn’t work for you.
- AlbertCory 5y ago
  > Animals love to warm their fur in shafts of sunlight too. Indeed. My dog always lies in the sun for a while when he goes outside. Once he's warm enough, he moves to the shade. Animals know.
  - supertofu 5y ago
    My blind cat always seeks sun spots as well!
- rohitb91 5y ago
  100% the same for me as well. When I sit in the sun I feel invigorated, I Feel a rush of pleasant feelings throughout my body. I take vitamin D regularly, 4000iu+, and I don’t feel anything remarkable. With the sun it’s almost an instant jolt of joy.
DoreenMichele 5y ago
Seattle is extremely damp and temperate, so you see a lot of mold and allergens there year round. If redressing your vitamin D levels doesn't fix it, look for hidden mold and/or allergies.
Trasmatta 5y ago
Since you're in Seattle, check out bright light therapy as well.
xwowsersx 5y ago
did you get blood work done again though after taking the 5K IUs for a while? it's possible that the supplementation didn't bring your Vit D levels to within range and you need 10K IUs+. Of course, I'm not suggesting this would necessarily help with your depression, but just pointing that you gotta be scientific/anecdotal when it comes to supplementation/blood panels
femiagbabiaka 5y ago
10k IU's a day is what it took me. I found that value almost by accident, while starting to follow Stan Efferding's Vertical Diet, which recommends that as a part of a suite of daily vitamins (it is much better than the name belies). IMO anyone who works a desk job should take 10k IU's daily. I fell out of the habit during covid quarantine and my levels (and my mood) were dangerously low when I came out on the other side.
TameAntelope 5y ago
5k IUs is well beyond anything your body has a use for, and in fact is above what your body can tolerate! [0] > RDA: The Recommended Dietary Allowance for adults 19 years and older is 600 IU daily for men and women, and for adults >70 years it is 800 IU daily. > UL: The Tolerable Upper Intake Level is the maximum daily intake unlikely to cause harmful effects on health. The UL for vitamin D for adults and children ages 9+ is 4,000 IU. So it's possible your 5k IUs were causing you more harm than good. [0] https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/vitamin-d/ https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/vitamin-d/
- mikenew 5y ago
  Those numbers are wrong by an order of magnitude, because the original estimation was based on faulty math. The actual dose needed to bring serum levels up for most people would be far higher. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4210929/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4210929/
  - TameAntelope 5y ago
    I'm going to go ahead and trust Harvard Medicine over a single study that has since gone largely uncited, and was published in "Nutrients" which carries an h-index of 115 (Nature, for example, carries an h-index of 1226) [0][1]. [0] https://www.scimagojr.com/journalsearch.php?q=19700188323&tip=sid&clean=0 https://www.scimagojr.com/journalsearch.php?q=19700188323&ti... [1] https://www.scimagojr.com/journalsearch.php?q=21206&tip=sid&clean=0 https://www.scimagojr.com/journalsearch.php?q=21206&tip=sid&...
    - beowulfey 5y ago
      You should never judge an article by where it was published (some exceptions of course), only in the quality of the work. Impact factors are loosely a measurement of significance of the work, in terms of how broadly applicable they are to the fields of science. It is absolutely not a strict measure of the expected quality of the article. Also, for what it's worth, most of the articles referenced in the Harvard Medicine review referring to dosages are from before 2010, so they may be out of date.
carabiner 5y ago
To answer a bunch of questions: Yes, I had bloodwork done later showing my D3 level in the typical range. Whether that was due to the supplement, or diet, or lifestyle I can't say. I take 1 pill (USP certified) on average 2-3x per week. So not every day. I've got treatment resistant depression and have tried probably everything else you're about to suggest. The only thing that kind of helped was dihydrotestosterone, but that is now illegal in the US. Also tianeptine and vorinostat, but also very hard to get in the US these days.
- laurentlbm 5y ago
  I have TRD too and tried so many things. It sucks.
- trts 5y ago
  Also in Seattle, also recovered from treatment resistant depression. I recommend looking into TMS. I wish I had done it much sooner. Wish you luck, it’s been an especially gloomy year here.
  - carabiner 5y ago
    Tried it through Neurostim in Bellevue. Didn't work. Waiting for the Stanford SAINT protocol to be approved.
- tsol 5y ago
  Did you try vorinostat yourself to treat depression, or was it coincidental? I never heard of that for depression, but looking at the mechanism it can make sense-- some HDAC inhibitors have powerful effects on mental issues
- pmoriarty 5y ago
  "I've got treatment resistant depression and have tried probably everything else you're about to suggest." I bet you haven't tried MDMA therapy.
m348e912 5y ago
I've run into this too. It's worth noting that there are a few different types of vitamin D. ergocalciferol - vitamin d2 derived from plants cholecalciferol - vitamin d3 from sunlight - vitamin d3 derived from lanolin washed from lambs wool - vitamin d3 derived from lichen I've tried a few different types, many don't seem to make me feel any different. Liquid vitamin d3 [0] seems to work well at doses above 5k IU. [0] https://www.amazon.com/Designs-Health-Emulsi-D3-Emulsified-Vitamin/dp/B0039N3J58/ https://www.amazon.com/Designs-Health-Emulsi-D3-Emulsified-V...
penetrarthur 5y ago
I wasn't depressed but had low energy levels. I started taking 24,000 IU a day and within two weeks I had way more energy, constantly elevated mood and just felt happy overall. I recently lowered the dose to 12,000 IU per day. I did blood test before that and I had super low Vitamin D3 levels and I live quite far up north.

numinoid 5y ago

Anecdotally, I had to bump up to 10,000 IU to see a difference.

civilized 5y ago

In this and the GP we have Vitamin D and depression in a nutshell.

mupuff1234 5y ago

Did you do another blood test to check if the levels changed?

trash3 5y ago

Check your diet. Just because you take vitamin d supplements doesn't mean it gets absorbed into your bloodstream.

tomatowurst 5y ago

5000 IU is really too much. At best 2000, 2500 IU is good.

dralley 5y ago
5000 isn't too much when you're catching up from a deficiency.
- BenjiWiebe 5y ago
  I took 15k IU daily (at the advice of my doctor) for several months at one point to get my levels back up. I don't remember the numbers, but my levels were extremely low.
Vecr 5y ago
No, 5000 IU per day is generally considered the highest non megadose. Make sure it is good quality (D3, USP in the US), and it should be fine. Some people say also to take K2 (also make sure it's USP in the US), but I'm not sure the exact supposed mechanism of protection from adverse effects from D3. Something about preventing calcium from leaching from the bones and accumulating in the blood, I think.
- pmoriarty 5y ago
  "Vitamin D controls the absorption of calcium into the blood. Vitamin K2 controls where that calcium ends up. "Over-supplementation of vitamin D3 without ample vitamin K2 leads to problems of excess calcium. "If calcium isn’t laid into bone, it will find itself in other tissues, like your arteries. Calcium in the arteries is BAD. It contributes to atherosclerosis and vessel stiffness." https://dralexrinehart.com/articles/the-vitamin-d-and-vitamin-k2-connection-understanding-the-mechanisms-what-to-test-and-how-much-d3-and-k2-to-take/ https://dralexrinehart.com/articles/the-vitamin-d-and-vitami...
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
mountainriver 5y ago
It really depends on the person. You just need to monitor your blood levels
LinuxBender 5y ago
I use 60,000 to 90,000 IU's per day and have been doing so for years. The most I have taken in a 24 hour period is 140,000 IU's. There is no way I could have started off at those levels however. It would have induced major hypercalcemia had I done that prior to mobilizing all the stored/misplaced calcium in my gut and vasculature. I am not suggesting anyone else do this. One must have a specific need when doing this. I only mention this to say that one can go well above the RDA/RDI that are highly contested to be far too low for modern diets, environmental inputs and lifestyles.
- TameAntelope 5y ago
  > Taking 60,000 international units (IU) a day of vitamin D for several months has been shown to cause toxicity. This level is many times higher than the U.S. Recommended Dietary Allowance (RDA) for most adults of 600 IU of vitamin D a day. [0] I think you may be poisoning yourself. [0] https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/nutrition-and-healthy-eating/expert-answers/vitamin-d-toxicity/faq-20058108 https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/nutrition-and-h...
  - LinuxBender 5y ago
    That would certainly be true had I done that from day one as I had mentioned. Their documentation as with most medical documentation is based on the lowest common denominators. They will not risk explaining why one might do what I am doing.
    - TameAntelope 5y ago
      It seems true without qualification. What you're saying here has a lot in common with "woo", I hope you realize.
      - LinuxBender 5y ago
        I suppose time will tell. I've been doing this a number of years. I will check back in a few more years to see how things are going. Honestly the cholecalciferol levels are the least taboo of the biohacking I do with myself. The more risky testing I did was to see how high I could go on the tocotrienols, tocopherols and fibrinolytic enzymes before I ran into bleeding.
dragonwriter 5y ago
Unless you are a doctor that has been monitoring the poster, you have no idea if that is true. My blood levels are consistently deficient when I’m not taking 10,000 IU/day (and this is with a fair amount of daily sun exposure.) People have widely varying needs.

cashsterling 5y ago

It can take a while for your Vit-D levels to rise, even with supplementing 5k IU per day... I would check your levels again. And, of course, Vit-D is not the only contributor to depression so it might be good to see a GP and/or get a general blood panel done.

olah_1 5y ago

I have never felt an affect from oral vitamins in any situation. Sitting in the sun however seems to do more than just “increase vitamin d levels”. The sensation is just overwhelmingly lovely. It seems to reduce cortisol, makes you feel tired in a euphoric way. Animals love to warm their fur in shafts of sunlight too. Perhaps we should be thinking more in terms of joyful activities in general and less trying to biohack.

hnick 5y ago
Yes sunlight makes me extremely tired, like if I go for a walk or a picnic or something I'll end up far more exhausted than anything else can explain. I wonder if it's some kind of overcompensating effect due to my typical lack of it.
__ryan__ 5y ago
That narrative might work for you, but the bio-hack narrative might work for others. Maybe the takeaway is to go into things with a positive attitude but also take a personal inventory and adapt if something that is supposed to work doesn’t work for you.
AlbertCory 5y ago
> Animals love to warm their fur in shafts of sunlight too. Indeed. My dog always lies in the sun for a while when he goes outside. Once he's warm enough, he moves to the shade. Animals know.
- supertofu 5y ago
  My blind cat always seeks sun spots as well!
rohitb91 5y ago
100% the same for me as well. When I sit in the sun I feel invigorated, I Feel a rush of pleasant feelings throughout my body. I take vitamin D regularly, 4000iu+, and I don’t feel anything remarkable. With the sun it’s almost an instant jolt of joy.

DoreenMichele 5y ago

Seattle is extremely damp and temperate, so you see a lot of mold and allergens there year round. If redressing your vitamin D levels doesn't fix it, look for hidden mold and/or allergies.

Trasmatta 5y ago

Since you're in Seattle, check out bright light therapy as well.

xwowsersx 5y ago

did you get blood work done again though after taking the 5K IUs for a while? it's possible that the supplementation didn't bring your Vit D levels to within range and you need 10K IUs+. Of course, I'm not suggesting this would necessarily help with your depression, but just pointing that you gotta be scientific/anecdotal when it comes to supplementation/blood panels

femiagbabiaka 5y ago

10k IU's a day is what it took me. I found that value almost by accident, while starting to follow Stan Efferding's Vertical Diet, which recommends that as a part of a suite of daily vitamins (it is much better than the name belies). IMO anyone who works a desk job should take 10k IU's daily. I fell out of the habit during covid quarantine and my levels (and my mood) were dangerously low when I came out on the other side.

TameAntelope 5y ago

5k IUs is well beyond anything your body has a use for, and in fact is above what your body can tolerate! [0] > RDA: The Recommended Dietary Allowance for adults 19 years and older is 600 IU daily for men and women, and for adults >70 years it is 800 IU daily. > UL: The Tolerable Upper Intake Level is the maximum daily intake unlikely to cause harmful effects on health. The UL for vitamin D for adults and children ages 9+ is 4,000 IU. So it's possible your 5k IUs were causing you more harm than good. [0] https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/vitamin-d/ https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/vitamin-d/

mikenew 5y ago
Those numbers are wrong by an order of magnitude, because the original estimation was based on faulty math. The actual dose needed to bring serum levels up for most people would be far higher. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4210929/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4210929/
- TameAntelope 5y ago
  I'm going to go ahead and trust Harvard Medicine over a single study that has since gone largely uncited, and was published in "Nutrients" which carries an h-index of 115 (Nature, for example, carries an h-index of 1226) [0][1]. [0] https://www.scimagojr.com/journalsearch.php?q=19700188323&tip=sid&clean=0 https://www.scimagojr.com/journalsearch.php?q=19700188323&ti... [1] https://www.scimagojr.com/journalsearch.php?q=21206&tip=sid&clean=0 https://www.scimagojr.com/journalsearch.php?q=21206&tip=sid&...
  - beowulfey 5y ago
    You should never judge an article by where it was published (some exceptions of course), only in the quality of the work. Impact factors are loosely a measurement of significance of the work, in terms of how broadly applicable they are to the fields of science. It is absolutely not a strict measure of the expected quality of the article. Also, for what it's worth, most of the articles referenced in the Harvard Medicine review referring to dosages are from before 2010, so they may be out of date.

carabiner 5y ago

To answer a bunch of questions: Yes, I had bloodwork done later showing my D3 level in the typical range. Whether that was due to the supplement, or diet, or lifestyle I can't say. I take 1 pill (USP certified) on average 2-3x per week. So not every day. I've got treatment resistant depression and have tried probably everything else you're about to suggest. The only thing that kind of helped was dihydrotestosterone, but that is now illegal in the US. Also tianeptine and vorinostat, but also very hard to get in the US these days.

laurentlbm 5y ago
I have TRD too and tried so many things. It sucks.
trts 5y ago
Also in Seattle, also recovered from treatment resistant depression. I recommend looking into TMS. I wish I had done it much sooner. Wish you luck, it’s been an especially gloomy year here.
- carabiner 5y ago
  Tried it through Neurostim in Bellevue. Didn't work. Waiting for the Stanford SAINT protocol to be approved.
tsol 5y ago
Did you try vorinostat yourself to treat depression, or was it coincidental? I never heard of that for depression, but looking at the mechanism it can make sense-- some HDAC inhibitors have powerful effects on mental issues
pmoriarty 5y ago
"I've got treatment resistant depression and have tried probably everything else you're about to suggest." I bet you haven't tried MDMA therapy.

m348e912 5y ago

I've run into this too. It's worth noting that there are a few different types of vitamin D. ergocalciferol - vitamin d2 derived from plants cholecalciferol - vitamin d3 from sunlight - vitamin d3 derived from lanolin washed from lambs wool - vitamin d3 derived from lichen I've tried a few different types, many don't seem to make me feel any different. Liquid vitamin d3 [0] seems to work well at doses above 5k IU. [0] https://www.amazon.com/Designs-Health-Emulsi-D3-Emulsified-Vitamin/dp/B0039N3J58/ https://www.amazon.com/Designs-Health-Emulsi-D3-Emulsified-V...

penetrarthur 5y ago

I wasn't depressed but had low energy levels. I started taking 24,000 IU a day and within two weeks I had way more energy, constantly elevated mood and just felt happy overall. I recently lowered the dose to 12,000 IU per day. I did blood test before that and I had super low Vitamin D3 levels and I live quite far up north.