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Was the Panzer II a tank? Because the Panzer II only weighed 9 tons. So the modern M2 Bradley has more armor _and_ a bigger gun. (Panzer II has a 20mm primary
by dragontamer 5y ago
Was the Panzer II a tank?
Because the Panzer II only weighed 9 tons. So the modern M2 Bradley has more armor _and_ a bigger gun. (Panzer II has a 20mm primary gun, M2 Bradley has a 30mm primary gun)
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I think the issue is that WW2 had definitions for tanks (light-tank, medium-tank, and heavy-tank). But today, armored-vehicles are classified by their tactics. (Ex: M2 Bradley would be a "WW2 Medium Tank", but the M2 Bradley's tactics / expected use case is really "IFV", infantry fighting vehicle).
Back in Ww2 days, there weren't many kinds of armored vehicles, and the systems of classification (and tactics) were just not very well defined yet.
Because today's wars are more complicated and have forced a change in military language to keep up with.
Case in point: I'd argue that the "modern Panzer II" is maybe something like the M113 APC (yeah... not really modern but...). With a 20mm gun, only ~12 tons of weight, the M113 APC would be a "light tank" in terms of WW2 terminology.
Of course, M113 is an "APC", not a tank. Panzer 2 wasn't a troop carrier either. But I think this example shows how the language has changed in the past 80 years, due to the change in armored-vehicle tactics.
- masklinn 5y ago> Because the Panzer II only weighed 9 tons. How is that of any relevance to GP’s comment?
- dragontamer 5y agoPanzer II has almost no armor. 9 tons is ridiculously small. The M113 APC has thicker armor than a Panzer II. If we take the phrase: > Most definitions of tanks rely on a heavily armored, tracked platform and a fully rotatable turret with armament capable of killing other similarly armored and armed vehicles. Then M113 APC "is a tank". (Big enough gun to kill other M113 APCs, armored and tracked, rotatable turret) ------- My overall point is that "WW2 terminology sucks", especially when describing modern vehicles.
- master_crab 5y agoIf you want to call a Bradley a tank, I don’t think that matters. But if it’s carrying troops to disgorge at a location then it is now no longer a tank but closer to an IFV or APC. It doesn’t change the definition of what a tank is.
- lostlogin 5y ago> Was the Panzer II a tank Yes, but definitions change with time. If you asked someone to describe a car, most people would probably include features that are absent from early car design.
- jandrewrogers 5y agoAs a technical nitpick, the M2 Bradley has a 25mm main gun, not 30mm.