4 ms·

"very problematic far-right"...lol. France had Le Pen in the final round, the EU has far-right ministers in govt across the union because of PR...the Tories are

"very problematic far-right"...lol. France had Le Pen in the final round, the EU has far-right ministers in govt across the union because of PR...the Tories are centre-right (if that, Tory govts after Blair have all been very centrist). That is why Brits are puzzled by the EU, it is fuelling the far-right. I understand why people from the EU are confused, because the far-right are in parliament in almost every nation and in govt in a few in the EU. The UK doesn't have a far right, they don't exist politically, our voting system means it is impossible. The only far-right political party in the UK was the BNP, they don't exist anymore, never elected to Parliament, and their height was electing a few local councillors (and MEPs...ofc, even our far-right figures flocked to the EU). Farage isn't far right, he is just called that because he opposed the EU. But UKIP has never had any MPs elected to Parliament, it has had 2 MPs (iirc) defect from the Tories, Farage has never been an MP, their only role has been in the EU Parliament. There is no connection between the far-right and Brexit either. If you look at the Cabinet, you will see non-white MPs who supported Brexit. It is sad that everything has to be overlaid with that context (again, one reason I am glad to be shot of the EU) but it makes no sense. I suppose Europe is content to keep fighting the battles of the early 20th century again, but people in the UK are happy to move forward (this is also why Brits are opposed to PR voting, sounds good in theory but then you look to Europe and see the nutters they have in govt...FPTP has neutralised that debate totally).

mrtksn 4y ago
Far-right isn't something that you fill paperwork and now you become far-right. IMHO sending asylum seekers to Rwanda for processing is something far-right would do. Creating hostile environment to achieve something is a thing that far-right would do. Controlling access to porn and arresting people for tweets is something far-right would do. Government officials acting as they are not laws for them is something that far right would do. Anyway, let's agree to disagree.
- thinkingemote 4y ago
  In the context of Europe, one needs to compare the Tory party to the self declared far right nationalist parties in Europe. Many of which hold actual positions in their governments. I'm sure you would agree it's all a matter of degree rather than a yes/no situation. The point is that in Europe there are further, more extreme far right parties. And they are increasing. However I don't think they are causing an actual problem at the EU level. There's also a counter argument that the UK should have remained in Europe to counter the rising European far right, to help moderate things at a continental level! Ironic but a little heard argument as the main campaign was that the EU didn't need the UK, rather it was the other way around (the UK needed the EU).
MattPalmer1086 4y ago
I notice you claim to speak for the British people (in more than one post). Brits believe this or don't believe that. It's OK to just put your own view forward. You don't have to claim to speak for the rest of us.
atchoo 4y ago
> The only far-right political party in the UK was the BNP, they don't exist anymore The BNP and The National Front just evolved into other groups like Britain First, English Defence League, English Democrats etc. and yes, UKIP. "Ukip is the party for decent supporters of the BNP" said Deputy Chair Neil Hamilton in 2014 for example. > The UK doesn't have a far right, they don't exist politically, our voting system means it is impossible. They absolutely do and political power is more than winning seats. UKIP's primary influence was simply by splitting the right wing vote so that the Conservatives had to move further right (and adopt hard Brexit positions) to neutralise them. UKIP has historically been at least a "further right" party beyond the mainstream. At best I would call it the suit wearing, dog-whistling front for the far-right. Under the new leader Batten it is more unambiguously far-right itself. It appointed Tommy Robinson (BNP member, EDL founder) as an advisor for example.

mrtksn 4y ago

Far-right isn't something that you fill paperwork and now you become far-right. IMHO sending asylum seekers to Rwanda for processing is something far-right would do. Creating hostile environment to achieve something is a thing that far-right would do. Controlling access to porn and arresting people for tweets is something far-right would do. Government officials acting as they are not laws for them is something that far right would do. Anyway, let's agree to disagree.

thinkingemote 4y ago
In the context of Europe, one needs to compare the Tory party to the self declared far right nationalist parties in Europe. Many of which hold actual positions in their governments. I'm sure you would agree it's all a matter of degree rather than a yes/no situation. The point is that in Europe there are further, more extreme far right parties. And they are increasing. However I don't think they are causing an actual problem at the EU level. There's also a counter argument that the UK should have remained in Europe to counter the rising European far right, to help moderate things at a continental level! Ironic but a little heard argument as the main campaign was that the EU didn't need the UK, rather it was the other way around (the UK needed the EU).

MattPalmer1086 4y ago

I notice you claim to speak for the British people (in more than one post). Brits believe this or don't believe that. It's OK to just put your own view forward. You don't have to claim to speak for the rest of us.

atchoo 4y ago

> The only far-right political party in the UK was the BNP, they don't exist anymore The BNP and The National Front just evolved into other groups like Britain First, English Defence League, English Democrats etc. and yes, UKIP. "Ukip is the party for decent supporters of the BNP" said Deputy Chair Neil Hamilton in 2014 for example. > The UK doesn't have a far right, they don't exist politically, our voting system means it is impossible. They absolutely do and political power is more than winning seats. UKIP's primary influence was simply by splitting the right wing vote so that the Conservatives had to move further right (and adopt hard Brexit positions) to neutralise them. UKIP has historically been at least a "further right" party beyond the mainstream. At best I would call it the suit wearing, dog-whistling front for the far-right. Under the new leader Batten it is more unambiguously far-right itself. It appointed Tommy Robinson (BNP member, EDL founder) as an advisor for example.