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I think that people underestimate what this feels like for the Plaid founder and potentially for Patrick too. For Plaid you've spent your life building this bu

I think that people underestimate what this feels like for the Plaid founder and potentially for Patrick too. For Plaid you've spent your life building this business. Presumably there are many happy customers and you're working really hard to define the space and provide service. One morning you flip on your laptop and see a headline that one of your customers (and competitors) launched a new service that directly competes with yours. As the founder of "attacked" company not only do you see the competition coming from a customer but from another "friendly" company in your space. Yesterday you were friends, today you're enemies. Doesn't matter who you are, this comes as a shock and it stings. Worse still, when you show up on HN, a space that in the past might have championed your service, you are now met with comments about how your customers are excited to switch. Showing up to HN and seeing your comrades immediately jump ship stings no matter who you are. And if you're Stripe leadership and you believe that you're playing an infinite game, then pissing off another similarly minded company (and supplier) isn't a good feeling either.

bestcoder69 4y ago
Please… my violin can’t get any tinier or we risk splitting the atom.
- Jcowell 4y ago
  I don’t think OP isn’t asking for sympathy but empathy? Is this the name of the game ? Yeah it is , always has , always will be. Does it suck for the loser ? Yes for course.
  - bestcoder69 4y ago
    It’s fair to ask I guess. But thats just gonna be another form of disappointment for them…
  - arinlen 4y ago
    > I don’t think OP isn’t asking for sympathy but empathy? Is this the name of the game ? Unless you believe a company like Plaid is entitled to a monopoly and should be free from any semblance of competition, I don't see a problem with that. What happened to free market capitalism?
    - Jcowell 4y ago
      It’s nothing about entitlement. It’s not a matter of whether stripe moving into the space is right or wrong. It’s about empathizing that when this kind of thing happens to a company the founder probably doesn’t feel too hot. You can try understand Plaid’s feelings right now while at the same time thinking Stripe is just doing what businesses will do.
  - rabidonrails 4y ago
    First, I think you hit the nail on the head in:Is this the name of the game ? Yeah it is , always has , always will be. Does it suck for the loser ? Yes for course. However, I didn't really ask for anything. In fact, what I think that bestcoder69 is missing is that the person who is asking/showing empathy is actually PC. If we look at what he wrote, he doesn't just come out and say something like tough luck for them, this is business, instead he says things like "we could have handled this better" and "...will retro this next week" and then lays out what the lessons should be for his team_ Just because empathy is important in business doesn't mean you aren't allowed to win.
- devoutsalsa 4y ago
  Maybe we can harness the energy from pity parties of sufficiently notable scope.
  - djbusby 4y ago
    The power of a thousand tiny violins?
darkerside 4y ago
CEOs are literally paid to deal with these emotions constructively. In this case, that would have looked like welcoming a competitor to the space and being ready to win on execution, because ideas are free.
- rchaud 4y ago
  Yeesh, I'm glad he didn't say that. What a vapid soundbite. I don't mean that to reflect on you, you worded it exactly as a CEO would. "We welcome competition", what a joke!
  - eli 4y ago
    What would you say? Making it personal I don't think helps anyone.
    - unethical_ban 4y ago
      I get the CEO speak, but I think rchaud is saying "no one welcomes competition - everyone wants a monopoly and to make as much money as possible". So saying otherwise sounds like garbage. People only "want competition" in the manner of controlled opposition, where they know they can beat someone.
      - darkerside 4y ago
        Competition is going to come whether you like it or not. You can whine about it, or you can use it as a tool to push yourself to be better. rchaud find this to be a platitude, but frankly, I don't give a shit what he thinks. If I'm a good CEO, I care much more about how my employees react to the new competition than to how this internet rando feels about my public response.
        unethical_ban 4y ago
        Speaking of effective communication, I don't think your tone effectively persuades skeptical listeners. You are on a forum of Internet randos, having a polite discussion.
voidfunc 4y ago
Im rolling my eyes at this. Dont get into business or politics if you have thin skin.
- Dayshine 4y ago
  So... Be born into a lift of luxury?
  - dymk 4y ago
    I thought the lofty rich were the ones with the thin skin, and it's the built-it-with-grit folks that have the thick sink.
gigatexal 4y ago
When your business becomes a feature of another larger offering it’s time to sell and move on.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
junofan 4y ago
10 years in I highly doubt either of them take anything that personally.
RcouF1uZ4gsC 4y ago
> As the founder of "attacked" company not only do you see the competition coming from a customer but from another "friendly" company in your space. Yesterday you were friends, today you're enemies. Doesn't matter who you are, this comes as a shock and it stings. Some time back, Steve Jobs felt the same way about Apple employees being offered positions at other companies, so he sent an email to his "friends". The result was an illegal "gentleman's agreement" not to hire each other's employees. Companies basing their decisions about entering a market based on what their "friends" at other companies think is market allocation, and it is illegal.
- junofan 4y ago
  Ok, the truth on the Jobs one is significantly more nuanced. Not everything is public. I don’t think it was a friendly thing haha.
cj 4y ago
I don't think anyone would argue that it's a blow to the chest for Plaid. But, that's business. Plaid has raised $700m+ and is valued $10+ billion according to Wikipedia. This move by Stripe is absolutely one that any competent leadership team should have expected would happen sooner or later.
- collectedparts 4y ago
  Nit: I think you meant "I don't think anyone would dispute that it's a blow". Saying "I don't think anyone would argue that X" means "I don't think anyone thinks X".
  - CPLX 4y ago
    I think his phrasing is also grammatical English. The degree to which it sounds right or wrong is probably idiomatic. "it's a blow to the chest for Plaid" is a coherent phrase "I don't think anyone would argue that" is a coherent phrase that contains a pronoun, "that." The antecedent of this pronoun is that first phrase. I don't think anyone would argue X can mean the statement X is so true nobody would argue it. An example would be "I don't think anyone would argue the legitimacy of George Washington as the first president of the US" or "I don't think anyone would argue the merits of food when you're hungry" Therefore the phrase can be correctly interpreted to mean: I don't think anyone would argue that -> [it's a blow to the the chest for Plaid]
    - jonny_eh 4y ago
      > is so true nobody would argue it. You mean: is so true nobody would argue AGAINST it. The ambiguity is whether argue means FOR or AGAINST.
      - CPLX 4y ago
        Indeed. Which makes the sentence work.
- pbreit 4y ago
wmf 4y ago
Stripe attempting to devour the entire financial stack should not have come as any surprise; their strategy is by now obvious from the long list of features they've launched over their history.
- powerslacker 4y ago
  Seems like they pull a stunt like this every year.
  - eatonphil 4y ago
    > pull a stunt You mean growing their business?
snake_doc 4y ago
Minor comment on the infinite game assumption from a game theory perspective . Stripe is clearly deviating, which means that they have made a payoff calculation that it’s better to do say despite being punished by Plaid and other players.
stu2b50 4y ago
I mean, I guess? I would feel a bit more sympathetic if it were a very small company, and very young. But while Plaid is small relative to Stripe, it's a _9 year old company_ that's worth 10-13 _billion_ dollars. If you're seriously that affected by other companies in the space launching competitor products... in the _9_ years of your company's existence, in a market evidently lucrative enough to net you a several billion dollar valuation... I'm not sure what to say.
arinlen 4y ago
> One morning you flip on your laptop and see a headline that one of your customers (and competitors) launched a new service that directly competes with yours. What's wrong with that?
kelnos 4y ago
Plaid is a huge company with a CEO who is presumably a professional adult. Making sarcastic, whiny commends on Twitter should be beneath him. He just sounds like a child throwing a tantrum because a company decided to compete with him. Not saying he shouldn't feel bad, or threatened, or upset -- those are perfectly valid feelings to have -- but airing those feelings like that is unprofessional and, frankly, pretty lame.
- JumpCrisscross 4y ago
  > sarcastic, whiny commends on Twitter should be beneath him. He just sounds like a child throwing a tantrum The problem is it looks like someone who feels they've been beaten. Twitter tantrums are precedented and tolerated for Silicon Valley CEOs at this point.
- ergocoder 4y ago
  Not only that. His tweet misled people. "Interview" turns out to be a job interview Jay had in 2014 before Jay even joined Stripe. Jay started working on this product in 2019. This is malicious. Plaid CEO intended to character-assassinate Jay.
cercatrova 4y ago
This is a strange comment. This is literally how business and competition works, and how customers benefit as a result. No doubt it sucks to have a product competed with but that's just business. Of all areas on the Internet I'd have expected those on HN to understand, as it's run by a VC who is all about disruption of the competition.
- Dma54rhs 4y ago
  And the the valuation fir the smaller company is 10 billion. Its not like they are crushing your mom and pop shop here.

bestcoder69 4y ago

Please… my violin can’t get any tinier or we risk splitting the atom.

Jcowell 4y ago
I don’t think OP isn’t asking for sympathy but empathy? Is this the name of the game ? Yeah it is , always has , always will be. Does it suck for the loser ? Yes for course.
- bestcoder69 4y ago
  It’s fair to ask I guess. But thats just gonna be another form of disappointment for them…
- arinlen 4y ago
  > I don’t think OP isn’t asking for sympathy but empathy? Is this the name of the game ? Unless you believe a company like Plaid is entitled to a monopoly and should be free from any semblance of competition, I don't see a problem with that. What happened to free market capitalism?
  - Jcowell 4y ago
    It’s nothing about entitlement. It’s not a matter of whether stripe moving into the space is right or wrong. It’s about empathizing that when this kind of thing happens to a company the founder probably doesn’t feel too hot. You can try understand Plaid’s feelings right now while at the same time thinking Stripe is just doing what businesses will do.
- rabidonrails 4y ago
  First, I think you hit the nail on the head in:Is this the name of the game ? Yeah it is , always has , always will be. Does it suck for the loser ? Yes for course. However, I didn't really ask for anything. In fact, what I think that bestcoder69 is missing is that the person who is asking/showing empathy is actually PC. If we look at what he wrote, he doesn't just come out and say something like tough luck for them, this is business, instead he says things like "we could have handled this better" and "...will retro this next week" and then lays out what the lessons should be for his team_ Just because empathy is important in business doesn't mean you aren't allowed to win.
devoutsalsa 4y ago
Maybe we can harness the energy from pity parties of sufficiently notable scope.
- djbusby 4y ago
  The power of a thousand tiny violins?

darkerside 4y ago

CEOs are literally paid to deal with these emotions constructively. In this case, that would have looked like welcoming a competitor to the space and being ready to win on execution, because ideas are free.

rchaud 4y ago
Yeesh, I'm glad he didn't say that. What a vapid soundbite. I don't mean that to reflect on you, you worded it exactly as a CEO would. "We welcome competition", what a joke!
- eli 4y ago
  What would you say? Making it personal I don't think helps anyone.
  - unethical_ban 4y ago
    I get the CEO speak, but I think rchaud is saying "no one welcomes competition - everyone wants a monopoly and to make as much money as possible". So saying otherwise sounds like garbage. People only "want competition" in the manner of controlled opposition, where they know they can beat someone.
    - darkerside 4y ago
      Competition is going to come whether you like it or not. You can whine about it, or you can use it as a tool to push yourself to be better. rchaud find this to be a platitude, but frankly, I don't give a shit what he thinks. If I'm a good CEO, I care much more about how my employees react to the new competition than to how this internet rando feels about my public response.
      - unethical_ban 4y ago
        Speaking of effective communication, I don't think your tone effectively persuades skeptical listeners. You are on a forum of Internet randos, having a polite discussion.

voidfunc 4y ago

Im rolling my eyes at this. Dont get into business or politics if you have thin skin.

Dayshine 4y ago
So... Be born into a lift of luxury?
- dymk 4y ago
  I thought the lofty rich were the ones with the thin skin, and it's the built-it-with-grit folks that have the thick sink.

gigatexal 4y ago

When your business becomes a feature of another larger offering it’s time to sell and move on.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

junofan 4y ago

10 years in I highly doubt either of them take anything that personally.

RcouF1uZ4gsC 4y ago

> As the founder of "attacked" company not only do you see the competition coming from a customer but from another "friendly" company in your space. Yesterday you were friends, today you're enemies. Doesn't matter who you are, this comes as a shock and it stings. Some time back, Steve Jobs felt the same way about Apple employees being offered positions at other companies, so he sent an email to his "friends". The result was an illegal "gentleman's agreement" not to hire each other's employees. Companies basing their decisions about entering a market based on what their "friends" at other companies think is market allocation, and it is illegal.

junofan 4y ago
Ok, the truth on the Jobs one is significantly more nuanced. Not everything is public. I don’t think it was a friendly thing haha.

cj 4y ago

I don't think anyone would argue that it's a blow to the chest for Plaid. But, that's business. Plaid has raised $700m+ and is valued $10+ billion according to Wikipedia. This move by Stripe is absolutely one that any competent leadership team should have expected would happen sooner or later.

collectedparts 4y ago
Nit: I think you meant "I don't think anyone would dispute that it's a blow". Saying "I don't think anyone would argue that X" means "I don't think anyone thinks X".
- CPLX 4y ago
  I think his phrasing is also grammatical English. The degree to which it sounds right or wrong is probably idiomatic. "it's a blow to the chest for Plaid" is a coherent phrase "I don't think anyone would argue that" is a coherent phrase that contains a pronoun, "that." The antecedent of this pronoun is that first phrase. I don't think anyone would argue X can mean the statement X is so true nobody would argue it. An example would be "I don't think anyone would argue the legitimacy of George Washington as the first president of the US" or "I don't think anyone would argue the merits of food when you're hungry" Therefore the phrase can be correctly interpreted to mean: I don't think anyone would argue that -> [it's a blow to the the chest for Plaid]
  - jonny_eh 4y ago
    > is so true nobody would argue it. You mean: is so true nobody would argue AGAINST it. The ambiguity is whether argue means FOR or AGAINST.
    - CPLX 4y ago
      Indeed. Which makes the sentence work.
pbreit 4y ago

wmf 4y ago

Stripe attempting to devour the entire financial stack should not have come as any surprise; their strategy is by now obvious from the long list of features they've launched over their history.

powerslacker 4y ago
Seems like they pull a stunt like this every year.
- eatonphil 4y ago
  > pull a stunt You mean growing their business?

snake_doc 4y ago

Minor comment on the infinite game assumption from a game theory perspective . Stripe is clearly deviating, which means that they have made a payoff calculation that it’s better to do say despite being punished by Plaid and other players.

stu2b50 4y ago

I mean, I guess? I would feel a bit more sympathetic if it were a very small company, and very young. But while Plaid is small relative to Stripe, it's a _9 year old company_ that's worth 10-13 _billion_ dollars. If you're seriously that affected by other companies in the space launching competitor products... in the _9_ years of your company's existence, in a market evidently lucrative enough to net you a several billion dollar valuation... I'm not sure what to say.

arinlen 4y ago

> One morning you flip on your laptop and see a headline that one of your customers (and competitors) launched a new service that directly competes with yours. What's wrong with that?

kelnos 4y ago

Plaid is a huge company with a CEO who is presumably a professional adult. Making sarcastic, whiny commends on Twitter should be beneath him. He just sounds like a child throwing a tantrum because a company decided to compete with him. Not saying he shouldn't feel bad, or threatened, or upset -- those are perfectly valid feelings to have -- but airing those feelings like that is unprofessional and, frankly, pretty lame.

JumpCrisscross 4y ago
> sarcastic, whiny commends on Twitter should be beneath him. He just sounds like a child throwing a tantrum The problem is it looks like someone who feels they've been beaten. Twitter tantrums are precedented and tolerated for Silicon Valley CEOs at this point.
ergocoder 4y ago
Not only that. His tweet misled people. "Interview" turns out to be a job interview Jay had in 2014 before Jay even joined Stripe. Jay started working on this product in 2019. This is malicious. Plaid CEO intended to character-assassinate Jay.

cercatrova 4y ago

This is a strange comment. This is literally how business and competition works, and how customers benefit as a result. No doubt it sucks to have a product competed with but that's just business. Of all areas on the Internet I'd have expected those on HN to understand, as it's run by a VC who is all about disruption of the competition.

Dma54rhs 4y ago
And the the valuation fir the smaller company is 10 billion. Its not like they are crushing your mom and pop shop here.