3 ms·

Eastern European cities aren't the only examples. Nordic cities (e.g. Stockholm and Copenhagen) are great examples - they have different problems but people are

Eastern European cities aren't the only examples. Nordic cities (e.g. Stockholm and Copenhagen) are great examples - they have different problems but people are housed. Cities like Berlin don't have a speculative housing market due to excellent renters rights meaning the majority of people rent long term. Finally, Vienna is the poster child for "how to do social housing".

glerk 5y ago
All these cities still have a housing market albeit a more regulated one than your average American city. Housing is still developed and owned by private interest and responds to supply and demand. We could debate the policies of these specific cities (for example, the trade-offs of Berlin's rent control: https://archive.ph/l3i2w https://archive.ph/l3i2w) but that's beyond the point. The parent's position is "housing shouldn't be a market", and I am showing an example of what soviet-style state control over housing looks like in practice.
Kiro 5y ago
What is Stockholm a great example of? There's still a housing market with absurd prices and all signs of a bubble. It's impossible to get an apartment in Stockholm unless you have a 20-year waiting time, buy an illegal third-hand contract or have the wealth to buy an apartment. The housing crisis in Sweden is extreme.
BlargMcLarg 5y ago
Almost every major city in Europe has the exact same problems. Or arguably worse, depending on your socioeconomic status. Where this myth of "European cities are great" is coming from I don't know, and I would love to know. >Due to excellent renters rights meaning the majority of people rent long term This backfires spectacularly once you realize landlords continue to hold the reigns and put up huge demands to avoid "bad renters". As long as the rights don't cover the entirety, landlords will continue to pressure renters in different, more obscene ways. And in today's society, renting long term also isn't as great as people make it out to be, when your long term rent is a glorified broom closet and there's a great job opportunity a few cities over.
adflux 5y ago
I was in Copenhagen last week and spoke to a dozen people who all agreed that the housing market there is terrible aswell.

glerk 5y ago

All these cities still have a housing market albeit a more regulated one than your average American city. Housing is still developed and owned by private interest and responds to supply and demand. We could debate the policies of these specific cities (for example, the trade-offs of Berlin's rent control: https://archive.ph/l3i2w https://archive.ph/l3i2w) but that's beyond the point. The parent's position is "housing shouldn't be a market", and I am showing an example of what soviet-style state control over housing looks like in practice.

Kiro 5y ago

What is Stockholm a great example of? There's still a housing market with absurd prices and all signs of a bubble. It's impossible to get an apartment in Stockholm unless you have a 20-year waiting time, buy an illegal third-hand contract or have the wealth to buy an apartment. The housing crisis in Sweden is extreme.

BlargMcLarg 5y ago

Almost every major city in Europe has the exact same problems. Or arguably worse, depending on your socioeconomic status. Where this myth of "European cities are great" is coming from I don't know, and I would love to know. >Due to excellent renters rights meaning the majority of people rent long term This backfires spectacularly once you realize landlords continue to hold the reigns and put up huge demands to avoid "bad renters". As long as the rights don't cover the entirety, landlords will continue to pressure renters in different, more obscene ways. And in today's society, renting long term also isn't as great as people make it out to be, when your long term rent is a glorified broom closet and there's a great job opportunity a few cities over.

adflux 5y ago

I was in Copenhagen last week and spoke to a dozen people who all agreed that the housing market there is terrible aswell.