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I want to avoid having to fetch my backup key every time I want to setup a new account. The backup key is kept offsite and thus inconvenient. It's offsite bec

I want to avoid having to fetch my backup key every time I want to setup a new account. The backup key is kept offsite and thus inconvenient. It's offsite because that protects me from fire or other such catastrophic events. This is what keeps me preferring password based security because I can backup my encrypted password database offsite with ease. Everything else provides hard path to recovery.

traceroute66 4y ago
> I want to avoid having to fetch my backup key every time I want to setup a new account. The backup key is kept offsite and thus inconvenient. As stated, you can have as many backup keys as you like. Thus you are not limited to two keys. Buy one more key. Keep one off-site and two on-prem. Rotate them once in a while to keep the off-site one fresh.
- zozbot234 4y ago
  > As stated, you can have as many backup keys as you like. That does not solve anything unless the backup keys are enrolled to each and every one of the services you use. Adding more backup keys and storing them more and more securely just makes it harder to be sure that you've enrolled them all to the latest service. This is not an issue if users are explicitly allowed to enroll "virtual" soft authenticators that they can back up and restore as they see fit, but that's an additional requirement that comes at some compromise, since some services might instead want to ensure that you're enrolling a non-cloneable credential. (E.g. your physical bank or non-remote employer, that can easily verify your identity via additional means if needed to restore your access.) The WebAuthn spec allows for both models.
- md_ 4y ago
  I think their point is that they don't want to have the window of vulnerability (to loss) when they have added a new account but haven't yet rotated their off-site key? That said, the real answer is that FIDO keys can be synced by e.g. Apple (as described in more detail here: https://www.wired.com/story/fido-alliance-ios-android-password-replacement/ https://www.wired.com/story/fido-alliance-ios-android-passwo...). So you can potentially just make your offsite backup be a hardware key that gets you into your iCloud keychain, and (if you are willing to trust Apple) use your iCloud for backing up all your other accounts' keys.

traceroute66 4y ago

> I want to avoid having to fetch my backup key every time I want to setup a new account. The backup key is kept offsite and thus inconvenient. As stated, you can have as many backup keys as you like. Thus you are not limited to two keys. Buy one more key. Keep one off-site and two on-prem. Rotate them once in a while to keep the off-site one fresh.

zozbot234 4y ago
> As stated, you can have as many backup keys as you like. That does not solve anything unless the backup keys are enrolled to each and every one of the services you use. Adding more backup keys and storing them more and more securely just makes it harder to be sure that you've enrolled them all to the latest service. This is not an issue if users are explicitly allowed to enroll "virtual" soft authenticators that they can back up and restore as they see fit, but that's an additional requirement that comes at some compromise, since some services might instead want to ensure that you're enrolling a non-cloneable credential. (E.g. your physical bank or non-remote employer, that can easily verify your identity via additional means if needed to restore your access.) The WebAuthn spec allows for both models.
md_ 4y ago
I think their point is that they don't want to have the window of vulnerability (to loss) when they have added a new account but haven't yet rotated their off-site key? That said, the real answer is that FIDO keys can be synced by e.g. Apple (as described in more detail here: https://www.wired.com/story/fido-alliance-ios-android-password-replacement/ https://www.wired.com/story/fido-alliance-ios-android-passwo...). So you can potentially just make your offsite backup be a hardware key that gets you into your iCloud keychain, and (if you are willing to trust Apple) use your iCloud for backing up all your other accounts' keys.