3 ms·

it depends if you are doing something to get paid, or to last, or to be really good. only in the first case do i ever consider a heap of abstractions

noitpmeder 4y ago
This is so backwards.
- the_cat_kittles 4y ago
  it really depends on what your doing mate!
kaba0 4y ago
Abstraction is the only thing that makes any of our advancements possible. Not even the simplest of math theses could be proves without a “framework” of relevant lemmas, nor could you write even a single hello world without the layers upon layers of abstractions written carefully over the decades. Sure, there is also bad abstraction, but the problem is the bad part, not the concept itself. Without abstractions you wouldn’t be able to read a text stored on a remote computer with accompanying style information displayed the same on both of our devices and with embedded 3D graphics doing the same thing on vastly differing devices be it a top of the line GPU or a simple low-end phone. Is it not abstraction?
- jseban 4y ago
  Well, if the abstractions were peer reviewed and put through the same rigour as mathematical proofs, that's a whole different topic. The equivalent would be a mathematical services company, who created "free" abstraction packages that required you to rewrite all your math, away from the scientific community standards, to fit their abstractions, and who also made money on consulting and selling books. And the big benefit of it all, is really that they only abstracted away writing summaries of your papers, which is actually the easiest part that is quite irrelevant to your research.
  - kaba0 4y ago
    But it is not math - we only have empirical evidence and not even much from that. Who is to tell whether the OSI model is ideal? It is more than likely not it, but we can’t measure these things up front, there is an insane cost associated with changing it, etc. Yet again, what is the alternative? We can’t manage complexity any other way, and essential complexity can’t be reduced.
    - the_only_law 4y ago
      > Who is to tell whether the OSI model is ideal? The current idea of the OSI model was also retrofitted from what it originally was.
  - mr_gibbins 4y ago
    Ooo, you're giving me LaTeX vibes!
- the_cat_kittles 4y ago
  i mostly mean the heap of stuff people often throw at problems. of course you cant do anything without abstractions. it helps to understand them better though.

noitpmeder 4y ago

This is so backwards.

the_cat_kittles 4y ago
it really depends on what your doing mate!

kaba0 4y ago

Abstraction is the only thing that makes any of our advancements possible. Not even the simplest of math theses could be proves without a “framework” of relevant lemmas, nor could you write even a single hello world without the layers upon layers of abstractions written carefully over the decades. Sure, there is also bad abstraction, but the problem is the bad part, not the concept itself. Without abstractions you wouldn’t be able to read a text stored on a remote computer with accompanying style information displayed the same on both of our devices and with embedded 3D graphics doing the same thing on vastly differing devices be it a top of the line GPU or a simple low-end phone. Is it not abstraction?

jseban 4y ago
Well, if the abstractions were peer reviewed and put through the same rigour as mathematical proofs, that's a whole different topic. The equivalent would be a mathematical services company, who created "free" abstraction packages that required you to rewrite all your math, away from the scientific community standards, to fit their abstractions, and who also made money on consulting and selling books. And the big benefit of it all, is really that they only abstracted away writing summaries of your papers, which is actually the easiest part that is quite irrelevant to your research.
- kaba0 4y ago
  But it is not math - we only have empirical evidence and not even much from that. Who is to tell whether the OSI model is ideal? It is more than likely not it, but we can’t measure these things up front, there is an insane cost associated with changing it, etc. Yet again, what is the alternative? We can’t manage complexity any other way, and essential complexity can’t be reduced.
  - the_only_law 4y ago
    > Who is to tell whether the OSI model is ideal? The current idea of the OSI model was also retrofitted from what it originally was.
- mr_gibbins 4y ago
  Ooo, you're giving me LaTeX vibes!
the_cat_kittles 4y ago
i mostly mean the heap of stuff people often throw at problems. of course you cant do anything without abstractions. it helps to understand them better though.