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just for those less familiar, it may be useful to note that the shift towards federal funds is typically linked to decreases in local funding for higher educati

by avs733 4y ago

just for those less familiar, it may be useful to note that the shift towards federal funds is typically linked to decreases in local funding for higher education. It isn't 'organic' there has been an outside forcing function.

nickff 4y ago
The shift to dependency on federal funding happened during and after the second world war. The federal government discovered they could speed up research by pouring money into universities, but never accounted for how this would change incentive structures, and eventually warp the universities.
derbOac 4y ago
That's true although in my discussions with university administration, there is a causal arrow that points a bit in the other direction too. I've had conversations with university presidents and other administration (in semi-private contexts) where it's basically stated "we don't need to advocate for state funding because we can sustain ourselves on federal funds." I note this not to criticize the administration (although you can do that), but to point out that this dynamic has repercussions in terms of incentives. If you're a university president or provost and getting pressure from a conservative legislature to not depend on public funding (which really means "state funding" to them, but that's another discussion), and all of a sudden the federal government becomes this cash flow source, you're going to run to it, and leverage that as "being a good citizen" with the legislature. I think the causal directions go in both ways and have these kind of amplifying effects.
- avs733 4y ago
  I have heard the same...but I honestly think that is a 'here lets not try' more so than a 'we wouldn't make use of it'. Totally agree with you on the rest. What is interesting is the admins now finding that those same legislators won't leave you alone even if they strip all your funding. They will mess with you for cheap points and sport.

by avs733 4y ago

nickff 4y ago

The shift to dependency on federal funding happened during and after the second world war. The federal government discovered they could speed up research by pouring money into universities, but never accounted for how this would change incentive structures, and eventually warp the universities.

derbOac 4y ago

That's true although in my discussions with university administration, there is a causal arrow that points a bit in the other direction too. I've had conversations with university presidents and other administration (in semi-private contexts) where it's basically stated "we don't need to advocate for state funding because we can sustain ourselves on federal funds." I note this not to criticize the administration (although you can do that), but to point out that this dynamic has repercussions in terms of incentives. If you're a university president or provost and getting pressure from a conservative legislature to not depend on public funding (which really means "state funding" to them, but that's another discussion), and all of a sudden the federal government becomes this cash flow source, you're going to run to it, and leverage that as "being a good citizen" with the legislature. I think the causal directions go in both ways and have these kind of amplifying effects.

avs733 4y ago
I have heard the same...but I honestly think that is a 'here lets not try' more so than a 'we wouldn't make use of it'. Totally agree with you on the rest. What is interesting is the admins now finding that those same legislators won't leave you alone even if they strip all your funding. They will mess with you for cheap points and sport.