4 ms·

Incredible useless comment.

by macco 4y ago

zer0-c00l 4y ago
true though
- Gualdrapo 4y ago
  No, it's not true. On the top of my head there is Inkscape which truly is intuitive (despite GTK) and, arguably with their latest betas, beautiful. I wish we could have something like it with Qt/KDE. Calligra's Karbon once was a nice promise but it is now only a shadow of what it was meant to be and even living a slow death.
  - memorable 4y ago
    The OP is saying that the comment that says GTK is unintuitive is useless is true, and you are saying that GTK is beautiful and intuitive, which is just confirming the OP's comment. I think you miss the point here.
n3storm 4y ago
"nothing" may be too much. But if very basic components like file choose and file save dialog are incredibly painful to be used with buttons scattered through all window corners (fitts law anyone?) then "nothing" starts resounding in your mind. https://python-gtk-3-tutorial.readthedocs.io/en/latest/_images/filechooserdialog_example.png https://python-gtk-3-tutorial.readthedocs.io/en/latest/_imag... You can find another control at bottom left to choose file codification or whatever. Font select dialog: https://docs.gtk.org/gtk3/fontchooser.png https://docs.gtk.org/gtk3/fontchooser.png Will gtk4 be any better? https://docs.gtk.org/gtk4/fontchooser.png https://docs.gtk.org/gtk4/fontchooser.png No, there is an extra settings button before select which looks to me totally secondary not to be present by the primary button. Primary actions should be together: - Choose letter - Choose size - Click select ...In a row or L movement We will get this extra UI darkening: now is not evident you can type font size numbers cause all controls are flat. In gtk3 at least inputs look like inputs and buttons look like buttons.
- randomsearch 4y ago
  The non-standard and objectively poor positioning of the buttons is fascinating. What was the logic behind this? It seems to me that designers are much less likely to give their time for free to a software project than programmers. Is that why OSS suffers from problems like this? A junior UI designer would never make these kinds of decisions. I can understand why designers wouldn’t work for free. What I don’t understand is why an average coder couldn’t do some basic googling and learn the fundamentals. You can get a long way by imitating commercial work and following standard conventions. So is it lack of skill, or some sort of mistaken belief that the conventions established by the experts are wrong? I’m wondering here if the idea is to imitate a forward/back step from a wizard (albeit with the buttons in the “wrong” vertical position) Not a paradigm appropriate for repeated everyday interactions, mainly because wizards are not designed for efficiency.
  - nigrioid 4y ago
    I think it's deliberate sabotage to prevent the year of the Linux desktop.
  - macco 4y ago
    The positioning is not objectively wrong. Where do you get this from? Did you make tests with people who never used a PC before? Who are not biased? Or is this your opinion, which would be subjectively by definition. UI usage is mostly learned. Just to be clear, I don't think GTK is the perfect UI system. In my opinion, there is none.
    - randomsearch 4y ago
      > The positioning is not objectively wrong. Yes, it is. There are lots of UX rules backed by research. Fitts' Law in this case is just one reason why this is wrong.
    - TuringTest 4y ago
      Why should tests be done with people who never used a PC before? User expectations are a large part of usability. Moreover, which users who never used a PC before would be using Gnome?

Incredible useless comment.

by macco 4y ago

Incredible useless comment.

zer0-c00l 4y ago

true though

Gualdrapo 4y ago
No, it's not true. On the top of my head there is Inkscape which truly is intuitive (despite GTK) and, arguably with their latest betas, beautiful. I wish we could have something like it with Qt/KDE. Calligra's Karbon once was a nice promise but it is now only a shadow of what it was meant to be and even living a slow death.
- memorable 4y ago
  The OP is saying that the comment that says GTK is unintuitive is useless is true, and you are saying that GTK is beautiful and intuitive, which is just confirming the OP's comment. I think you miss the point here.

n3storm 4y ago

"nothing" may be too much. But if very basic components like file choose and file save dialog are incredibly painful to be used with buttons scattered through all window corners (fitts law anyone?) then "nothing" starts resounding in your mind. https://python-gtk-3-tutorial.readthedocs.io/en/latest/_images/filechooserdialog_example.png https://python-gtk-3-tutorial.readthedocs.io/en/latest/_imag... You can find another control at bottom left to choose file codification or whatever. Font select dialog: https://docs.gtk.org/gtk3/fontchooser.png https://docs.gtk.org/gtk3/fontchooser.png Will gtk4 be any better? https://docs.gtk.org/gtk4/fontchooser.png https://docs.gtk.org/gtk4/fontchooser.png No, there is an extra settings button before select which looks to me totally secondary not to be present by the primary button. Primary actions should be together: - Choose letter - Choose size - Click select ...In a row or L movement We will get this extra UI darkening: now is not evident you can type font size numbers cause all controls are flat. In gtk3 at least inputs look like inputs and buttons look like buttons.

randomsearch 4y ago
The non-standard and objectively poor positioning of the buttons is fascinating. What was the logic behind this? It seems to me that designers are much less likely to give their time for free to a software project than programmers. Is that why OSS suffers from problems like this? A junior UI designer would never make these kinds of decisions. I can understand why designers wouldn’t work for free. What I don’t understand is why an average coder couldn’t do some basic googling and learn the fundamentals. You can get a long way by imitating commercial work and following standard conventions. So is it lack of skill, or some sort of mistaken belief that the conventions established by the experts are wrong? I’m wondering here if the idea is to imitate a forward/back step from a wizard (albeit with the buttons in the “wrong” vertical position) Not a paradigm appropriate for repeated everyday interactions, mainly because wizards are not designed for efficiency.
- nigrioid 4y ago
  I think it's deliberate sabotage to prevent the year of the Linux desktop.
- macco 4y ago
  The positioning is not objectively wrong. Where do you get this from? Did you make tests with people who never used a PC before? Who are not biased? Or is this your opinion, which would be subjectively by definition. UI usage is mostly learned. Just to be clear, I don't think GTK is the perfect UI system. In my opinion, there is none.
  - randomsearch 4y ago
    > The positioning is not objectively wrong. Yes, it is. There are lots of UX rules backed by research. Fitts' Law in this case is just one reason why this is wrong.
  - TuringTest 4y ago
    Why should tests be done with people who never used a PC before? User expectations are a large part of usability. Moreover, which users who never used a PC before would be using Gnome?