5 ms·

I wish the US would go after companies like this. Instead the US is ran for the companies.

by DonnyV 4y ago

fsloth 4y ago
All successful countries to a large extent are run for the companies, but the border between public, private and regulated/un-regulated is different.
baisq 4y ago
And that’s why all tech companies are in the US, employ people there and generate wealth there.
- zeven7 4y ago
  Except most were also started by Americans or people who had already moved to America for other reasons.
CountSessine 4y ago
Apple isn’t an EU company so they get regulated hard. Volkswagen was pumping tons of NOx into the air in EU cities for years and regulators there rolled over and looked the other way the whole time. But in the US they got regulated hard.
- thefz 4y ago
  It's because US companies are used to shitting so far outside of the can that sometimes you have to reposition them over the toilet.
- kuschku 4y ago
  And that's why it's good to have competition and good to have multiple powers regulating each other.
  - CountSessine 4y ago
    Yes I think the same thing. “Regulatory competition”? Maybe the only truly effective antidote to regulatory capture.
    - toxik 4y ago
      The market tends towards monopolies. That is why you have the FTC, SEC, etc. So regulatory competition would lead to regulatory monopoly, unless you introduce meta regulators and the cycle begins anew.
- Youden 4y ago
  It's a popular opinion on HN that the EU picks on American companies but to offer an alternative theory: American companies are more often subject to EU penalties because they more frequently/severely break EU law. American companies more frequently break EU law because they're used to the US regulatory environment, which is so loose that in many areas it may as well not exist. In the rare situations where a regulator does start to speak up, it's easily manipulated through lobbying (see FCC common carrier regulations as an example). Part of it is also cultural/economic. American companies are aggressive and come to Europe when they've already amassed a large war chest from their business success in the US, so they're willing to risk a fight with European regulators because they know they'll be able to fund it. European companies are more conservative, so less willing to clash with regulators, and they have to survive in Europe from their inception, so may not be able to afford a large legal battle.
  - outside1234 4y ago
    A lot more of this sort of favoritism goes on behind the scenes in Europe. I have personally seen RFPs that "had to" go to French vendors, etc., etc.
    - atchoo 4y ago
      It's common in most countries for publically funded things like defence or government contracts to have a minimum percentage of home grown development/manufacturing in the tender.
    - Youden 4y ago
      You see that everywhere, even in the US. "American made" is often seen as a badge of honour but it requires excluding European suppliers. Even aside from the marketing label, there are practicalities achieved by choosing a domestic business partner, like simplification of legal issues.
  - hilbert42 4y ago
    "American companies more frequently break EU law because they're used to the US regulatory environment, which is so loose that in many areas it may as well not exist." There's little doubt that this is true. Given US history from independence onward, the question is why does the US environment so often favor corporate rights and protection for corporations over that of freedoms and interests of individuals. It seems to me that the reality of US governance (its emphasis) is the reverse of what one would expect. The only conclusion I can come to is that citizens in the US democracy have effectively considerably lower representation than do corporations through some systemic problem with their democracy. That's to say the reality is not one vote per person but effectively each citizen's vote is worth much less than that. Why is it thus?
- sangnoir 4y ago
  > Volkswagen was pumping tons of NOx into the air in EU cities for years and regulators there rolled over Are we still pretending like Volkswagen was the only manufacturer breaking/'gaming' the rules on pollution? Or that Japanese and American[1] car-makers were not doing the same? Well, they were. 1. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/vw-just-the-latest-in-long-history-of-cheating-car-companies/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/vw-just-the-latest-in-long-hist...
  - CountSessine 4y ago
    Are we still pretending like Are you actually pretending that any of these cases compares to the scope and the depth of Volkswagen's treachery and lawbreaking with "clean diesel"?
zamalek 4y ago
> [article] evidence on our file indicates that Apple's conduct cannot be justified by security concerns The biggest thing is that EU fact checks the bullshit that these companies spew. The US simply has, let's call it "successfully lobbied," senators listen to "expert witness" statements.
- jakearmitage 4y ago
  Oh, definitely. They did a great job fact checking Volkswagen: https://www.spiegel.de/auto/aktuell/peter-mock-vom-icct-ueber-den-vw-abgasskandal-a-1054338.html https://www.spiegel.de/auto/aktuell/peter-mock-vom-icct-uebe... I really don't understand how Americophobia can be so disproportionate among HN crowd. Does anyone honestly think politicians in a specific part of the world are not corrupt?
  - tpush 4y ago
    The sentiment on HN toward any given country depends on which country's people is currently awake. At the time the article was posted, and currently still, it's probably more Europeans than Americans.
  - bluescarni 4y ago
    > Does anyone honestly think politicians in a specific part of the world are not corrupt? Just because American democracy is failing, it does not mean democracy is failing everywhere.
    - kompatible 4y ago
      Is Hungary's corruption a result of "American democracy failing" or is that homegrown?
    - usrn 4y ago
      Democracy is only "failing" when the people vote in politicians that create barriers for certain investment bankers.
  - zamalek 4y ago
username_my1 4y ago
was there ever a case of anti-trust law discouraging competition / innovation ? on the other side monopolies are known to do that.

I wish the US would go after companies like this. Instead the US is ran for the companies.

by DonnyV 4y ago

I wish the US would go after companies like this. Instead the US is ran for the companies.

All successful countries to a large extent are run for the companies, but the border between public, private and regulated/un-regulated is different.

baisq 4y ago

And that’s why all tech companies are in the US, employ people there and generate wealth there.

zeven7 4y ago
Except most were also started by Americans or people who had already moved to America for other reasons.

CountSessine 4y ago

Apple isn’t an EU company so they get regulated hard. Volkswagen was pumping tons of NOx into the air in EU cities for years and regulators there rolled over and looked the other way the whole time. But in the US they got regulated hard.

thefz 4y ago
It's because US companies are used to shitting so far outside of the can that sometimes you have to reposition them over the toilet.
kuschku 4y ago
And that's why it's good to have competition and good to have multiple powers regulating each other.
- CountSessine 4y ago
  Yes I think the same thing. “Regulatory competition”? Maybe the only truly effective antidote to regulatory capture.
  - toxik 4y ago
    The market tends towards monopolies. That is why you have the FTC, SEC, etc. So regulatory competition would lead to regulatory monopoly, unless you introduce meta regulators and the cycle begins anew.
Youden 4y ago
It's a popular opinion on HN that the EU picks on American companies but to offer an alternative theory: American companies are more often subject to EU penalties because they more frequently/severely break EU law. American companies more frequently break EU law because they're used to the US regulatory environment, which is so loose that in many areas it may as well not exist. In the rare situations where a regulator does start to speak up, it's easily manipulated through lobbying (see FCC common carrier regulations as an example). Part of it is also cultural/economic. American companies are aggressive and come to Europe when they've already amassed a large war chest from their business success in the US, so they're willing to risk a fight with European regulators because they know they'll be able to fund it. European companies are more conservative, so less willing to clash with regulators, and they have to survive in Europe from their inception, so may not be able to afford a large legal battle.
- outside1234 4y ago
  A lot more of this sort of favoritism goes on behind the scenes in Europe. I have personally seen RFPs that "had to" go to French vendors, etc., etc.
  - atchoo 4y ago
    It's common in most countries for publically funded things like defence or government contracts to have a minimum percentage of home grown development/manufacturing in the tender.
  - Youden 4y ago
    You see that everywhere, even in the US. "American made" is often seen as a badge of honour but it requires excluding European suppliers. Even aside from the marketing label, there are practicalities achieved by choosing a domestic business partner, like simplification of legal issues.
- hilbert42 4y ago
  "American companies more frequently break EU law because they're used to the US regulatory environment, which is so loose that in many areas it may as well not exist." There's little doubt that this is true. Given US history from independence onward, the question is why does the US environment so often favor corporate rights and protection for corporations over that of freedoms and interests of individuals. It seems to me that the reality of US governance (its emphasis) is the reverse of what one would expect. The only conclusion I can come to is that citizens in the US democracy have effectively considerably lower representation than do corporations through some systemic problem with their democracy. That's to say the reality is not one vote per person but effectively each citizen's vote is worth much less than that. Why is it thus?
sangnoir 4y ago
> Volkswagen was pumping tons of NOx into the air in EU cities for years and regulators there rolled over Are we still pretending like Volkswagen was the only manufacturer breaking/'gaming' the rules on pollution? Or that Japanese and American[1] car-makers were not doing the same? Well, they were. 1. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/vw-just-the-latest-in-long-history-of-cheating-car-companies/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/vw-just-the-latest-in-long-hist...
- CountSessine 4y ago
  Are we still pretending like Are you actually pretending that any of these cases compares to the scope and the depth of Volkswagen's treachery and lawbreaking with "clean diesel"?

zamalek 4y ago

> [article] evidence on our file indicates that Apple's conduct cannot be justified by security concerns The biggest thing is that EU fact checks the bullshit that these companies spew. The US simply has, let's call it "successfully lobbied," senators listen to "expert witness" statements.

jakearmitage 4y ago
Oh, definitely. They did a great job fact checking Volkswagen: https://www.spiegel.de/auto/aktuell/peter-mock-vom-icct-ueber-den-vw-abgasskandal-a-1054338.html https://www.spiegel.de/auto/aktuell/peter-mock-vom-icct-uebe... I really don't understand how Americophobia can be so disproportionate among HN crowd. Does anyone honestly think politicians in a specific part of the world are not corrupt?
- tpush 4y ago
  The sentiment on HN toward any given country depends on which country's people is currently awake. At the time the article was posted, and currently still, it's probably more Europeans than Americans.
- bluescarni 4y ago
  > Does anyone honestly think politicians in a specific part of the world are not corrupt? Just because American democracy is failing, it does not mean democracy is failing everywhere.
  - kompatible 4y ago
    Is Hungary's corruption a result of "American democracy failing" or is that homegrown?
  - usrn 4y ago
    Democracy is only "failing" when the people vote in politicians that create barriers for certain investment bankers.
- zamalek 4y ago

username_my1 4y ago

was there ever a case of anti-trust law discouraging competition / innovation ? on the other side monopolies are known to do that.