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Most probably the Russians already know where the bunker is located, the same as the Ukrainians know where Putin is at any one moment, the ties between the Russ

Most probably the Russians already know where the bunker is located, the same as the Ukrainians know where Putin is at any one moment, the ties between the Russians and the Ukrainians are so mingled that it's impossible for spies/undercover agents not to exist on both sides, close to the highest levels. It's just that the Russians blowing up Zelensky's bunker would not help them all that much, at least for now. I'd say the inverse is also true, killing Putin at this exact moment won't bring peace and a Russian surrender (whatever that might mean) immediately.

deleted 5y ago
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simonh 5y ago
I’m not sure about that. I don’t see how anyone else in Russia has a personal stake in this war. The problem is Putin being killed is not the same as Putin dropping dead. Whoever took over would have an imperative to take vengeance on whoever killed Putin, just on general principle, so it very much depends how it was done, who did it and what information was out about that.
- paganel 5y ago
  The "fortress under siege" mantra has had a long life in Russia (and in now the former USSR), maybe the 1990s were a short reprieve in that respect (when parts of the Russian elites genuinely wanted to integrate the Western institutions) but generally speaking I'd say that ever since 1917 most of the Russian elites have seen the outside world as "them", as the "other that wants us down". It's not a "one man thing". This "hitlerification" of Putin hides a lot of facts on the ground, to the detriment of the West, which is why maybe they've dialed that discourse down a little in the last two weeks or so.
  - simonh 5y ago
    I agree the mind set is there, but this particular war is a debacle. With Putin gone they might find it a lot easier to disentangle from it.
H8crilA 5y ago
The location is well known because that bunker was built under the USSR. And it is strong/deep enough that only a powerful nuclear explosion would endanger it. This is a very serious bunker we're talking about. What they [Russians] might not know is all the modern exits and connections (to the metro system and elsewhere) that have been built since then, or things like supply chains for food, location and current state of the air filtration or communication systems. BTW, since we're talking about bunkers: the US military in their what-if-shit-hits-the-fan plans has a very hard nut to crack with the Chinese air force, which brilliantly built their aircraft hangars deep inside mountains. It may not be immediately obvious, but the best way to counter an air force is to destroy the aircraft before they take off. Doesn't work if the hangar-bunker is 100% resilient to any kind of a conventional bomb that you could drop on it.
- cycomanic 5y ago
  Just wanted to say this is not something particularly special to the Chinese. For example in Sweden they build the (cold war) airbases around the country underground. They would use regular roads (that were widened in particular places) as runways. You can visit one of those near Gothenburg: https://www.guidebook-sweden.com/en/guidebook/destination/aeroseum-air-force-museum-gothenburg https://www.guidebook-sweden.com/en/guidebook/destination/ae...
jollybean 5y ago
They know where it is, but I'm sure there are other bunkers, and all sorts of other details will have changed.

deleted 5y ago

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simonh 5y ago

I’m not sure about that. I don’t see how anyone else in Russia has a personal stake in this war. The problem is Putin being killed is not the same as Putin dropping dead. Whoever took over would have an imperative to take vengeance on whoever killed Putin, just on general principle, so it very much depends how it was done, who did it and what information was out about that.

paganel 5y ago
The "fortress under siege" mantra has had a long life in Russia (and in now the former USSR), maybe the 1990s were a short reprieve in that respect (when parts of the Russian elites genuinely wanted to integrate the Western institutions) but generally speaking I'd say that ever since 1917 most of the Russian elites have seen the outside world as "them", as the "other that wants us down". It's not a "one man thing". This "hitlerification" of Putin hides a lot of facts on the ground, to the detriment of the West, which is why maybe they've dialed that discourse down a little in the last two weeks or so.
- simonh 5y ago
  I agree the mind set is there, but this particular war is a debacle. With Putin gone they might find it a lot easier to disentangle from it.

H8crilA 5y ago

The location is well known because that bunker was built under the USSR. And it is strong/deep enough that only a powerful nuclear explosion would endanger it. This is a very serious bunker we're talking about. What they [Russians] might not know is all the modern exits and connections (to the metro system and elsewhere) that have been built since then, or things like supply chains for food, location and current state of the air filtration or communication systems. BTW, since we're talking about bunkers: the US military in their what-if-shit-hits-the-fan plans has a very hard nut to crack with the Chinese air force, which brilliantly built their aircraft hangars deep inside mountains. It may not be immediately obvious, but the best way to counter an air force is to destroy the aircraft before they take off. Doesn't work if the hangar-bunker is 100% resilient to any kind of a conventional bomb that you could drop on it.

cycomanic 5y ago
Just wanted to say this is not something particularly special to the Chinese. For example in Sweden they build the (cold war) airbases around the country underground. They would use regular roads (that were widened in particular places) as runways. You can visit one of those near Gothenburg: https://www.guidebook-sweden.com/en/guidebook/destination/aeroseum-air-force-museum-gothenburg https://www.guidebook-sweden.com/en/guidebook/destination/ae...

jollybean 5y ago

They know where it is, but I'm sure there are other bunkers, and all sorts of other details will have changed.