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I make a distinction between "Plastic" and "Carbon Fibre Reinforced Polymer with a magnesium roll cage" that this laptop uses. We don't think an aluminium bike

I make a distinction between "Plastic" and "Carbon Fibre Reinforced Polymer with a magnesium roll cage" that this laptop uses. We don't think an aluminium bike is better than a carbon fibre bike, so why is an aluminium laptop better than a carbon fibre laptop? I mean aluminium has some nice advantages like heat dissipation but CFRP allows for much lighter laptops. If anything I prefer CRFP because of the weight advantages and because it's more of a "sleeper" material when laptops are VERY tempting for thieves.

ainiriand 5y ago
Aluminum for me is a big no-no considering that I always get static discharge from them.
- DoingIsLearning 5y ago
  I also distinctly remember the unnerving feeling of getting a tingling sensation on my wrists when having a macboook pro charging connecting to mains. I have only used them when clients specifically request it, but otherwise connect them to a workstation of my choice.
  - XorNot 5y ago
    Oh, I'm glad I'm not the only person who noticed this - several job laptops (macbooks) have definitely done this to me as well. It's subtle, like your wrist is sticky or being tapped rapidly, but the moment you yank the mains power out from the machine it goes away. Very unsettling (and escalates to painful at times).
    - lloeki 5y ago
      I used to experience this as well, on multiple MacBooks across years. It seems to have disappeared when I moved to a non-MagSafe USB-C charging generation of MacBooks (can't say for the latest ones though).
  - jbverschoor 5y ago
    Yeah I had that with MacBooks which are brand new. Feels like a static electrical layer. But after some time it’s gone
  - JetSetWilly 5y ago
    It is because it is not grounded. The leakage current then goes into the case. Unfortunately it seems to be quite difficult to buy grounded usb-c chargers. Most of them seem to come with C7 cables with no ground.
    - 323 5y ago
      Grounding doesn't make much sense for devices which are completely plastic encased. I get your point about "pass-through grounding" to the laptop, but then again, a lot of time the laptop is not connecting to a charging wire anyway.
      - JetSetWilly 5y ago
        The problem is - laptops used to have their own dedicated chargers. And generally speaking, they were grounded. Now we're moving to usb-c though, it means we've lost it being grounded. And many laptops are made of conductive materials so therefore it is an extremely minor annoyance and downside of usb-c. Also, I'm in the UK with its crap ring circuits packed with 240v/13amps. I'd rather have a ground when I'm one fault away from 3000 watts momentarily being delivered to my lap. Especially with these exciting new GaN chargers and their open circuit failure modes..
        323 5y ago
        My understanding is that all chargers, GaN or not, are required to use a transformer to electrically separate the primary (wall input) from the secondary (charger output). So a fault directly connecting you to the wall circuit should not be possible with an authentic charger.
golergka 5y ago
> why is an aluminium laptop better than a carbon fibre laptop? It looks nice. Which is completely subjective, of course, and purely about aesthetics. But for a personal item like a laptop, I think aesthetics are much more important than HN comments would let you believe.
323 5y ago
> We don't think an aluminium bike is better than a carbon fibre bike Depends on how you define better. Carbon bikes are prone to catastrophic failure, and if you fall often are a bad idea. Of course, you might just say "just don't fall".
- TAKEMYMONEY 5y ago
  Aluminum bikes are just as prone to failure, and in fact are less likely to be left in a repairable state after an accident. A dent or a crack in the frame ofter renders it useless. True of carbon as well, but they can be repaired in some cases; aluminum frames almost always need to be scrapped.
- sudosysgen 5y ago
  Yes, honestly, a good aluminium frame is preferable to carbon for 90% of people. The small tradeoff in weight and vibration/stiffness characteristics is really not worth the loss in structural integrity, money, and peace of mind.
  - TAKEMYMONEY 5y ago
    Modern carbon frames are designed with structural integrity in mind, the frame-building process allows more fine-tuning than aluminum. Aluminum's best quality is it's value, you can wreck one and buy another and still have spent less than a low-grade CF frame.
    - sudosysgen 5y ago
      Not quite. Carbon fiber is a composite. Structural integrity is not one dimensional, and while carbon fiber frames are great in their intended loads, they are bad in puncture and abrasion, and that is inherent to carbon fiber. It is so much easier to wreck a carbon fiber frame than an alu frame. It just takes one pointy rock or one bad slide. Whereas an alu frame will only receive cosmetic damage
      - TAKEMYMONEY 5y ago
Steltek 5y ago
Re: bikes, I've found most CF frames lack fender/rack mounts. If you want utility (commuting, shopping, travel), aluminum is going to win out. For example, I can't think of a single CF cargo bike.
- steelframe 5y ago
  My username may give this away, but after tens of thousands of miles ridden on a variety of frames, I've settled on chromoly steel as the most versatile material. In fact I just picked up another steel frame bike this past weekend with a rack for panniers and a fork that can fit gravel tires. Regardless I find it very strange to compare a laptop with a bicycle. You would pick the materials when constructing either one for very different reasons.
- Liskni_si 5y ago
  Specialized Diverge does have fender/rack mounts (although you need to replace the stock seat post clamp with another one for the top rear rack mounts, but Spec does sell one). It's not exactly a utility bike, but for touring around civilized Europe it's a very good bike. :-)

ainiriand 5y ago

Aluminum for me is a big no-no considering that I always get static discharge from them.

DoingIsLearning 5y ago
I also distinctly remember the unnerving feeling of getting a tingling sensation on my wrists when having a macboook pro charging connecting to mains. I have only used them when clients specifically request it, but otherwise connect them to a workstation of my choice.
- XorNot 5y ago
  Oh, I'm glad I'm not the only person who noticed this - several job laptops (macbooks) have definitely done this to me as well. It's subtle, like your wrist is sticky or being tapped rapidly, but the moment you yank the mains power out from the machine it goes away. Very unsettling (and escalates to painful at times).
  - lloeki 5y ago
    I used to experience this as well, on multiple MacBooks across years. It seems to have disappeared when I moved to a non-MagSafe USB-C charging generation of MacBooks (can't say for the latest ones though).
- jbverschoor 5y ago
  Yeah I had that with MacBooks which are brand new. Feels like a static electrical layer. But after some time it’s gone
- JetSetWilly 5y ago
  It is because it is not grounded. The leakage current then goes into the case. Unfortunately it seems to be quite difficult to buy grounded usb-c chargers. Most of them seem to come with C7 cables with no ground.
  - 323 5y ago
    Grounding doesn't make much sense for devices which are completely plastic encased. I get your point about "pass-through grounding" to the laptop, but then again, a lot of time the laptop is not connecting to a charging wire anyway.
    - JetSetWilly 5y ago
      The problem is - laptops used to have their own dedicated chargers. And generally speaking, they were grounded. Now we're moving to usb-c though, it means we've lost it being grounded. And many laptops are made of conductive materials so therefore it is an extremely minor annoyance and downside of usb-c. Also, I'm in the UK with its crap ring circuits packed with 240v/13amps. I'd rather have a ground when I'm one fault away from 3000 watts momentarily being delivered to my lap. Especially with these exciting new GaN chargers and their open circuit failure modes..
      - 323 5y ago
        My understanding is that all chargers, GaN or not, are required to use a transformer to electrically separate the primary (wall input) from the secondary (charger output). So a fault directly connecting you to the wall circuit should not be possible with an authentic charger.

golergka 5y ago

> why is an aluminium laptop better than a carbon fibre laptop? It looks nice. Which is completely subjective, of course, and purely about aesthetics. But for a personal item like a laptop, I think aesthetics are much more important than HN comments would let you believe.

323 5y ago

> We don't think an aluminium bike is better than a carbon fibre bike Depends on how you define better. Carbon bikes are prone to catastrophic failure, and if you fall often are a bad idea. Of course, you might just say "just don't fall".

TAKEMYMONEY 5y ago
Aluminum bikes are just as prone to failure, and in fact are less likely to be left in a repairable state after an accident. A dent or a crack in the frame ofter renders it useless. True of carbon as well, but they can be repaired in some cases; aluminum frames almost always need to be scrapped.
sudosysgen 5y ago
Yes, honestly, a good aluminium frame is preferable to carbon for 90% of people. The small tradeoff in weight and vibration/stiffness characteristics is really not worth the loss in structural integrity, money, and peace of mind.
- TAKEMYMONEY 5y ago
  Modern carbon frames are designed with structural integrity in mind, the frame-building process allows more fine-tuning than aluminum. Aluminum's best quality is it's value, you can wreck one and buy another and still have spent less than a low-grade CF frame.
  - sudosysgen 5y ago
    Not quite. Carbon fiber is a composite. Structural integrity is not one dimensional, and while carbon fiber frames are great in their intended loads, they are bad in puncture and abrasion, and that is inherent to carbon fiber. It is so much easier to wreck a carbon fiber frame than an alu frame. It just takes one pointy rock or one bad slide. Whereas an alu frame will only receive cosmetic damage
    - TAKEMYMONEY 5y ago

Steltek 5y ago

Re: bikes, I've found most CF frames lack fender/rack mounts. If you want utility (commuting, shopping, travel), aluminum is going to win out. For example, I can't think of a single CF cargo bike.

steelframe 5y ago
My username may give this away, but after tens of thousands of miles ridden on a variety of frames, I've settled on chromoly steel as the most versatile material. In fact I just picked up another steel frame bike this past weekend with a rack for panniers and a fork that can fit gravel tires. Regardless I find it very strange to compare a laptop with a bicycle. You would pick the materials when constructing either one for very different reasons.
Liskni_si 5y ago
Specialized Diverge does have fender/rack mounts (although you need to replace the stock seat post clamp with another one for the top rear rack mounts, but Spec does sell one). It's not exactly a utility bike, but for touring around civilized Europe it's a very good bike. :-)