3 ms·

The cost and size of hydrogen storage would very likely preclude its use except if its out-of-town and then the great cost of piping it around would negate that

The cost and size of hydrogen storage would very likely preclude its use except if its out-of-town and then the great cost of piping it around would negate that usefulness. Huge solid (stone, concrete) insulated heat-banks electrically heated by solar-power might be usable. But they'd pretty much have to be stored underground. The cost of doing so would be enormous. And it would very likely be impossible to retrofit existing buildings.

_hypx 5y ago
That is utterly wrong. Hydrogen storage and piping would be vastly cheaper than thermal storage in huge heat banks. In particular, you would store the hydrogen underground. Very few proposals are suggesting otherwise. Piping hydrogen would be no different than piping natural gas, and retrofits are fully possible. There's no way of transferring heat stored in big rocks at all, as far as I know.
- simonblack 5y ago
  Piping hydrogen would be no different than piping natural gas, On the face of it, that would appear to be true. But far larger amounts of Hydrogen would be required to produce the same amount of energy than the equivalent amount of natural gas. "But because hydrogen is so much lighter, or less dense, you need approximately 3 times the volume of hydrogen as compared to natural gas to get the same amount of energy." - https://www.powereng.com/library/6-things-to-remember-about-hydrogen-vs-natural-gas https://www.powereng.com/library/6-things-to-remember-about-... Generally, to transport and store Hydrogen, it is liquefied. That introduces a whole new set of problems, as you have to use metals that continue to be strong at very low temperatures for pipes and tanks. https://www.energy.gov/eere/fuelcells/hydrogen-storage-challenges https://www.energy.gov/eere/fuelcells/hydrogen-storage-chall...
  - _hypx 5y ago
    If you are just talking about hydrogen piping, the velocity of hydrogen flow is faster than natural gas. It becomes very similar in terms of flow rate for a given diameter of pipe.

_hypx 5y ago

That is utterly wrong. Hydrogen storage and piping would be vastly cheaper than thermal storage in huge heat banks. In particular, you would store the hydrogen underground. Very few proposals are suggesting otherwise. Piping hydrogen would be no different than piping natural gas, and retrofits are fully possible. There's no way of transferring heat stored in big rocks at all, as far as I know.

simonblack 5y ago
Piping hydrogen would be no different than piping natural gas, On the face of it, that would appear to be true. But far larger amounts of Hydrogen would be required to produce the same amount of energy than the equivalent amount of natural gas. "But because hydrogen is so much lighter, or less dense, you need approximately 3 times the volume of hydrogen as compared to natural gas to get the same amount of energy." - https://www.powereng.com/library/6-things-to-remember-about-hydrogen-vs-natural-gas https://www.powereng.com/library/6-things-to-remember-about-... Generally, to transport and store Hydrogen, it is liquefied. That introduces a whole new set of problems, as you have to use metals that continue to be strong at very low temperatures for pipes and tanks. https://www.energy.gov/eere/fuelcells/hydrogen-storage-challenges https://www.energy.gov/eere/fuelcells/hydrogen-storage-chall...
- _hypx 5y ago
  If you are just talking about hydrogen piping, the velocity of hydrogen flow is faster than natural gas. It becomes very similar in terms of flow rate for a given diameter of pipe.