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>>r that Tweeting memes is how adult professionals handle workplace disagreements Clearly you have not experienced Teams or Slack where MEME's are pretty commo

by syshum 4y ago

>>r that Tweeting memes is how adult professionals handle workplace disagreements Clearly you have not experienced Teams or Slack where MEME's are pretty common in both even in professional discussions. There is even a built in interface for search for meme's / gifs to respond with. >what was his actual goal in tweeting the image? To convey a complex point in less than 180 characters by using a image which we all know is worth 1000 words far more than you can put in a text response To believe the meme's goal was "harassment" furthers the stereotype that people on the political left just cant meme.... The meme was in no way targeted harassment. >>predictable misogynistic backlash. So if that is the foundation, does this mean women are never to be criticized at all because some 3rd party may respond to that criticism in a misogynistic way. Sorry I reject that premise

ModernMech 4y ago
> Clearly you have not experienced Teams or Slack I have, but what Musk did here would be considered incredibly out of line in my workplace. The meme database doesn't have a category for memes targeting my subordinates (and yes to the other poster I know that Elon Musk is not technically her boss yet, but for all intents and purposes the pecking order has been established already). But beyond that, exactly 0 sentences of our disagreements happen over public channels in front of millions of followers. > using a image which we all know is worth 1000 words far more than you can put in a text response That's part of the problem. One thing I've noticed about Elon Musk (and similar people who aim to craft a cult of personality) is that his followers project whatever hero they need onto him. As public as Musk is, he has a wide variety of followers some of whom are in fact quite misogynistic, and very much enjoy to read misogyny as one of those 1000 unspoken words conveyed by Musk posting that image. They then act on those misogynistic thoughts by attacking the target of Musk's meme. The same kind of dynamic existed for Trump. Is that Musk's direct fault? No, he doesn't literally cause people to post misogynistic things. But Musk's cult of personality does in fact have a power to move people to act, and depending on how Musk wields that power he can in fact predictably move people toward certain actions. Tweeting about spaceship launches gets his followers excited about spaceship launches. There's no explosion of misogyny against particular women after Musk tweets about a success at Tesla or SpaceX. But Tweeting attacks against specific people gets his followers to attack specific people. Some of those attacks are legitimate argument grounded in logic. But a great many more of those attacks were the basest human thoughts imaginable. People also attacked her race, so that's why I'm not saying that the tweet itself was misogynistic, but it elicited misogyny. It wasn't racist, but it elicited racism. And that's the power Musk has -- the power to move crowds to do his bidding. Which in fact makes what he did all the more reprehensible, because he did it as he decries this very power being wielded by "woke mobs". He did the exact same thing. So my problem with Musk's tweet is that he can't just tweet like the rest of us. He has a power, and as a fan of comics he should know that comes with great responsibility. Even the most misogynistic incels in the world posting the most hateful screeds imaginable can't move thousands of other likeminded people to similarly do so in a targeted fashion. Because they have no power. But Elon Musk with 0 malice in his heart can rain down hate and harassment on anyone through his followers if he's careless. > The meme was in no way targeted harassment. But it was targeted against an individual, and the predictable result was in fact harassment so.... Let me put it this way: if Musk really didn't mean for this person to be harassed, he could have posted a follow-up tweet expressing his concern that the harassment was happening and to defend the person he specifically targeted. That didn't happen so I think we know where he stands.
- syshum 4y ago
  >The meme database doesn't have a category for memes targeting my subordinates good news is that likely will be a short relationship, as he is likely terminating all over paid Twitter Execs day 1. Hopefully Day 2 is looking for a relocation site for Twitter out of CA >One thing I've noticed about Elon Musk Or more likely Elon does not spend a inordinate amount of time over analyzing every damn thing he posts for every angle for which people could "take offense" or other such things, he posts what is on his mind as someone with a respect for free expression will. Political Correct expression is killing society, and I find it refreshing and genuine, I liked 1990's internet... It was fun I despise political correctness >>because he did it as he decries this very power being wielded by "woke mobs". He did the exact same thing. 100% in correct. "woke mobs" direct, and excuse physical violence against their targets, "woke mobs" advocate direct action It is difference between direct and indirect advocacy..... For example "Punch a Nazi" with "nazi" being "anyone that disagrees with me politically" >Musk's tweet is that he can't just tweet like the rest of us. he absolutely can and should, I dont care if you have 1 or 1,000,000,000,000 followers, you should be able to post in the exact same manner, anyone that disagree clearly hates the very idea of free expression, and is the enemy of said principle >>But it was targeted against an individual, I would say it was more targeted at position, or a dept with in twitter, for which an individual had voluntarily made themselves the face of. This individual was/is proud of their censorship efforts, and wanted to attach their name to those efforts in a public way. That changes the metric IMO. If this would have been just come random twitter engineer I may agree with you.
  - ModernMech 4y ago
    > Or more likely Elon does not spend a inordinate amount of time over analyzing every damn thing he posts for every angle for which people could "take offense" or other such things That Elon Musk spends no time reflecting on how his words affect other people in the world around him is eminently clear. > he absolutely can and should, I dont care if you have 1 or 1,000,000,000,000 followers, you should be able to post in the exact same manner I guess this worldview is summarized: with great power comes no responsibility. Can't say the zeitgeist disagrees with you.

by syshum 4y ago

ModernMech 4y ago

> Clearly you have not experienced Teams or Slack I have, but what Musk did here would be considered incredibly out of line in my workplace. The meme database doesn't have a category for memes targeting my subordinates (and yes to the other poster I know that Elon Musk is not technically her boss yet, but for all intents and purposes the pecking order has been established already). But beyond that, exactly 0 sentences of our disagreements happen over public channels in front of millions of followers. > using a image which we all know is worth 1000 words far more than you can put in a text response That's part of the problem. One thing I've noticed about Elon Musk (and similar people who aim to craft a cult of personality) is that his followers project whatever hero they need onto him. As public as Musk is, he has a wide variety of followers some of whom are in fact quite misogynistic, and very much enjoy to read misogyny as one of those 1000 unspoken words conveyed by Musk posting that image. They then act on those misogynistic thoughts by attacking the target of Musk's meme. The same kind of dynamic existed for Trump. Is that Musk's direct fault? No, he doesn't literally cause people to post misogynistic things. But Musk's cult of personality does in fact have a power to move people to act, and depending on how Musk wields that power he can in fact predictably move people toward certain actions. Tweeting about spaceship launches gets his followers excited about spaceship launches. There's no explosion of misogyny against particular women after Musk tweets about a success at Tesla or SpaceX. But Tweeting attacks against specific people gets his followers to attack specific people. Some of those attacks are legitimate argument grounded in logic. But a great many more of those attacks were the basest human thoughts imaginable. People also attacked her race, so that's why I'm not saying that the tweet itself was misogynistic, but it elicited misogyny. It wasn't racist, but it elicited racism. And that's the power Musk has -- the power to move crowds to do his bidding. Which in fact makes what he did all the more reprehensible, because he did it as he decries this very power being wielded by "woke mobs". He did the exact same thing. So my problem with Musk's tweet is that he can't just tweet like the rest of us. He has a power, and as a fan of comics he should know that comes with great responsibility. Even the most misogynistic incels in the world posting the most hateful screeds imaginable can't move thousands of other likeminded people to similarly do so in a targeted fashion. Because they have no power. But Elon Musk with 0 malice in his heart can rain down hate and harassment on anyone through his followers if he's careless. > The meme was in no way targeted harassment. But it was targeted against an individual, and the predictable result was in fact harassment so.... Let me put it this way: if Musk really didn't mean for this person to be harassed, he could have posted a follow-up tweet expressing his concern that the harassment was happening and to defend the person he specifically targeted. That didn't happen so I think we know where he stands.

syshum 4y ago
>The meme database doesn't have a category for memes targeting my subordinates good news is that likely will be a short relationship, as he is likely terminating all over paid Twitter Execs day 1. Hopefully Day 2 is looking for a relocation site for Twitter out of CA >One thing I've noticed about Elon Musk Or more likely Elon does not spend a inordinate amount of time over analyzing every damn thing he posts for every angle for which people could "take offense" or other such things, he posts what is on his mind as someone with a respect for free expression will. Political Correct expression is killing society, and I find it refreshing and genuine, I liked 1990's internet... It was fun I despise political correctness >>because he did it as he decries this very power being wielded by "woke mobs". He did the exact same thing. 100% in correct. "woke mobs" direct, and excuse physical violence against their targets, "woke mobs" advocate direct action It is difference between direct and indirect advocacy..... For example "Punch a Nazi" with "nazi" being "anyone that disagrees with me politically" >Musk's tweet is that he can't just tweet like the rest of us. he absolutely can and should, I dont care if you have 1 or 1,000,000,000,000 followers, you should be able to post in the exact same manner, anyone that disagree clearly hates the very idea of free expression, and is the enemy of said principle >>But it was targeted against an individual, I would say it was more targeted at position, or a dept with in twitter, for which an individual had voluntarily made themselves the face of. This individual was/is proud of their censorship efforts, and wanted to attach their name to those efforts in a public way. That changes the metric IMO. If this would have been just come random twitter engineer I may agree with you.
- ModernMech 4y ago
  > Or more likely Elon does not spend a inordinate amount of time over analyzing every damn thing he posts for every angle for which people could "take offense" or other such things That Elon Musk spends no time reflecting on how his words affect other people in the world around him is eminently clear. > he absolutely can and should, I dont care if you have 1 or 1,000,000,000,000 followers, you should be able to post in the exact same manner I guess this worldview is summarized: with great power comes no responsibility. Can't say the zeitgeist disagrees with you.