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I wonder if I'm the only one reading that finds the term "gentile" as moderately offensive. It seems to map the world into Jewish ontology of "God's chosen peo
by wheels 4y ago
I wonder if I'm the only one reading that finds the term "gentile" as moderately offensive. It seems to map the world into Jewish ontology of "God's chosen people", and other. "Non-Jew" feels less abrasive since it only assumes the (obvious) existence of Judaism.
I find Judaism super interesting historically (and have some Jewish ancestory and have spent a couple months in Israel), but still the term "gentile" in a modern, non-religious context feels abrasive.
- mensetmanusman 4y agoWhat you get offended by is an excellent source of introspection. I have worked with teens of the wealthy elite who are offended if one asks them to do chores (some call it abuse). Our current culture glorifies victimhood, so people are more attuned to being offended.
- unmole 4y agoHow would you like to be referred to as a barbarian, a kaffir or a mleccha?
- mensetmanusman 4y agoI would not care, especially if it is over the Internet. Not everyone has adjusted their priors on what it means for global dialogue, especially in the framework where there will always be someone in the world that will take offense to almost everything one says. I more just feel sorry for these people, as most of them are dealing with other pain and stress in life, and they lash out irrationally like this.
- mgiampapa 4y agoYou are not alone, having lived in Brooklyn in Orthodox areas, I have encountered some ridiculous racism from the orthodox community. Frankly even a trip to Costco in Brooklyn will give you a huge amount of perspective on how many view non-orthodox jews as "Others" and "Non-People". That said, I also worked with the Safardic Jewish community doing tech in the garment industry and as the token gentile I was loved on and respected for my work. Like every culture there is a broad spectrum, but if the Orthodox jews of NYC are anything to go on, I am seriously questioning why they are choosing to live here.
- TchoBeer 4y agoThere are a lot of Jewish communities in Brooklyn and it's hard to know what you're referring to, but if I am correct, they're so insulated against the outside world that they could really move anywhere (and often do, for cheaper housing prices, as has happened to many a modern orthodox community)
- mgiampapa 4y agoYeah, that's the thing I don't understand. NYC is known as a melting pot of cultures and it isn't inexpensive at all, even out at the far ends of the NRD and B trains. Why be in a great cosmopolitan city if you aren't going to give your neighbor the time of day when you go out and interact? It's not like I'm talking about interactions at a Yeshiva or a Synagogue, but out doing every day things like shopping, or going to for a walk in the park.
- TchoBeer 4y agoThey live there because they immigrated through new York and settled down in New York. That doesn't mean they're required to integrate with the modern world, as much as that attitude disgusts me.
- mgiampapa 4y agoRequired to integrate, no. Should they be polite members of civil society? Yes. My issue isn't what they do in their congregations and communities, but how they interact with the rest of the world. I've personally been treated extremely poorly by strangers in the Orthodox community just going about my day in the city. Between that and other experiences, I'm just shocked at how prevalent racism is among the Jewish Orthodox community in particular.
- seoaeu 4y agoYou're asking why a community that's lived somewhere for generations does just all of a sudden pack their bags and GTFO?
- bumblebritches5 4y ago
- skissane 4y agoPart of why it is so common in English is not due to Jews, but rather the enduring influence of Christianity. The Jew vs Gentile distinction is historically important in Christianity, and plays a significant (albeit variable) role in many Christian theologies
- roenxi 4y ago"Gentile" derives from Latin gentilis, which itself derives from the Latin gens, meaning clan or tribe. [0] I don't think you are in a position to get offended on this one. Doesn't seem to even be a Hebrew word. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gentile#Etymology https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gentile#Etymology
- unmole 4y agoAnd negro is derived from the Spanish word for black, nothing offensive. It's almost as if intent and context matters more than etymology.
- roenxi 4y agoWhat changes if the Jews call people non-Jews v. gentiles? The context and intent is identical. Unless we just want to be offended by existance of Jews and the idea of a Jew/non-Jew divide existing.
- unmole 4y agoWhat changes if we call people negros instead of black? > Unless we just want to be offended by existance of Jews If you dislike the use of a world, you must be an anti-Semite? I guess the people who dislike the Spanish derived term must be anti-Hispanic.
- roenxi 4y ago> What changes if we call people negros instead of black? Well, they're a minority. If the majority loses control then they are at extreme risk of being hit by an ethnic cleansing or something. It can happen pretty much anywhere with only a relatively short lead-up. Picking a stupid act and making it compulsory is a classic way to keep tabs on how the wind is blowing. There isn't really any threat like that from the Jews posed to anyone else, they don't have the numbers. There is no need to police them; indeed policing the language of minorities trying to maintain their own culture is in really bad taste. The issue with negro doesn't have anything to do with the word itself being offensive; that has the same logical problems as objecting to 'gentile' does.
- unmole 4y ago> I wonder if I'm the only one reading that finds the term "gentile" as moderately offensive. You're not the only one. The use of the Latin derived gentile seems like a clear case of Othering.
- TchoBeer 4y agoI didn't realize it had that connotation for some people, I'll be more careful about that in the future.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]