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I don't know that I'd lay the blame at retail traders not being sophisticated enough to understand this. I'd lay the blame with the company that had such poor r

I don't know that I'd lay the blame at retail traders not being sophisticated enough to understand this. I'd lay the blame with the company that had such poor risk controls that they allowed this to happen in the first place.

gruez 4y ago
>I don't know that I'd lay the blame at retail traders not being sophisticated enough to understand this. I'm not sure how you got the impression that the parent comment was laying the blame on the user. I interpreted it as excusing the behavior of robinhood. Blame isn't a zero sum game, it's possible to argue that robinhood is less blameworthy without saying that the retail traders are to blame. >I'd lay the blame with the company that had such poor risk controls that they allowed this to happen in the first place. What risk controls? As per the parent comment, it's an issue with settlement/collateral requirements, and robinhood not being prepared to satisfy them in light of a stock going 10x in a short period of time. I'm not sure how "risk controls" would have helped.
- rurp 4y ago
  Maybe I'm missing something, but isn't the answer to simply have more collateral? Given that RH was able to raise emergency funds around this time it seems really likely that they could have been better capitalized before the turbulence started, and gotten the money on better terms than an emergency deal. They probably didn't do this because they underestimated the need for it (poor risk models), or simply didn't want to pay the extra cost.
michaelgrosner2 4y ago
In a way I sympathize with RH. If they were truthful that they didn't have enough money, they would have had to publicly admit they couldn't cover the purchases, which could have led to a run on them and everyone pulling out of Robinhood at once. In some ways, pulling the buy button was the best option they had. Too bad they didn't account for the fact that it would spawn a thousand conspiracy theories.
- lovecg 4y ago
  It’s the classic “do you lie or do you cause a stampede” dilemma. Similar to the masks shortage debacle in the early pandemic.
- cco 4y ago
  I do as well to a degree, in fact those clearing houses turned the absolute _screws_ to Robinhood, increasing the collateral requirements quite above and beyond what is normal. Robinhood was stuck between a rock and a hard place, squeezed from both sides, but unfortunately they chose to stay "silent" and stonewall their users, the wrong move imo. They had an opportunity to rail at the system and cast themselves as the vanguard and champion of their users's rights. They were doing everything they could to cover the collateral obligations, but the big bad clearing houses and various market makers were dead set at dousing a bit of water on the fire. Instead they kept to the line, "There is no liquidity problem", which was a bald faced lie to protect against a run and/or loss of faith as you point out. If there was any lesson to take from GME/meme stocks, "lack of faith" due to poor fundamentals is not a problem haha. Users would have LOVED Robinhood more if they perceived them as helping them fight "the power". But they chose not to and anecdotally any of my friends that were caught up cooled considerably on Robinhood, I don't know a single of my dozen or so acquaintances still using it fearing that Robinhood will fail them when it is critical.

gruez 4y ago

>I don't know that I'd lay the blame at retail traders not being sophisticated enough to understand this. I'm not sure how you got the impression that the parent comment was laying the blame on the user. I interpreted it as excusing the behavior of robinhood. Blame isn't a zero sum game, it's possible to argue that robinhood is less blameworthy without saying that the retail traders are to blame. >I'd lay the blame with the company that had such poor risk controls that they allowed this to happen in the first place. What risk controls? As per the parent comment, it's an issue with settlement/collateral requirements, and robinhood not being prepared to satisfy them in light of a stock going 10x in a short period of time. I'm not sure how "risk controls" would have helped.

rurp 4y ago
Maybe I'm missing something, but isn't the answer to simply have more collateral? Given that RH was able to raise emergency funds around this time it seems really likely that they could have been better capitalized before the turbulence started, and gotten the money on better terms than an emergency deal. They probably didn't do this because they underestimated the need for it (poor risk models), or simply didn't want to pay the extra cost.

michaelgrosner2 4y ago

In a way I sympathize with RH. If they were truthful that they didn't have enough money, they would have had to publicly admit they couldn't cover the purchases, which could have led to a run on them and everyone pulling out of Robinhood at once. In some ways, pulling the buy button was the best option they had. Too bad they didn't account for the fact that it would spawn a thousand conspiracy theories.

lovecg 4y ago
It’s the classic “do you lie or do you cause a stampede” dilemma. Similar to the masks shortage debacle in the early pandemic.
cco 4y ago
I do as well to a degree, in fact those clearing houses turned the absolute _screws_ to Robinhood, increasing the collateral requirements quite above and beyond what is normal. Robinhood was stuck between a rock and a hard place, squeezed from both sides, but unfortunately they chose to stay "silent" and stonewall their users, the wrong move imo. They had an opportunity to rail at the system and cast themselves as the vanguard and champion of their users's rights. They were doing everything they could to cover the collateral obligations, but the big bad clearing houses and various market makers were dead set at dousing a bit of water on the fire. Instead they kept to the line, "There is no liquidity problem", which was a bald faced lie to protect against a run and/or loss of faith as you point out. If there was any lesson to take from GME/meme stocks, "lack of faith" due to poor fundamentals is not a problem haha. Users would have LOVED Robinhood more if they perceived them as helping them fight "the power". But they chose not to and anecdotally any of my friends that were caught up cooled considerably on Robinhood, I don't know a single of my dozen or so acquaintances still using it fearing that Robinhood will fail them when it is critical.