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With the Microsoft-Qualcomm ARM exclusivity deal ending very soon, Microsoft could make Windows 11 available for Apple Silicon platforms. This would benefit bot

With the Microsoft-Qualcomm ARM exclusivity deal ending very soon, Microsoft could make Windows 11 available for Apple Silicon platforms. This would benefit both Apple and Microsoft at the expense of Qualcomm (who would need to compete directly with Apple's pace of ARM development).

garaetjjte 4y ago
Why would they port Windows to their competitor platform?
- mschuster91 4y ago
  Apple and Microsoft have cooperated for years to bring Bootcamp on the x86 platform. Apple, no matter the OS, still makes a ton of margin on the hardware.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- dwaite 4y ago
  On Microsoft's homepage (e.g. for a primary consumer focus), they list Windows behind Office 365 and behind the Xbox and Surface. For corporate use, they are pushing seats for O365 and other hosted services as well as selling Azure-based hosting. The loss of the mobile phone market and hits to the low end by Chrome OS means that pursuing a platform lock-in strategy is no longer viable.
  - garaetjjte 4y ago
    >On Microsoft's homepage (e.g. for a primary consumer focus), they list Windows behind Office 365 and behind the Xbox and Surface. Windows consumer revenue comes from preinstalled licenses, they don't need to advertise it directly. M1 Windows port would be admitting defeat and kill Surface. For Office, they already have MacOS version of it.
    - kergonath 4y ago
      If they enable something like Boot Camp, those OEM licences would just be replaced by consumer ones, I am not sure it’d be much worse in terms of bottom line. Their Surface line has already tons of of competition from all the Wintel manufacturers anyway.
    - philistine 4y ago
      When you say it would kill Surface, are you 100% sure that all those corporatey types would stop buying those machines? Kill is a strong word.
  - zamadatix 4y ago
    The platform lock-in strategy being no longer viable seems like a reason Windows wouldn't be ported, after all it IS the platform. Things like Office are already available for macOS and Apple isn't going to sell MS the M1 for Surface laptops.
- _ph_ 4y ago
  First of all, why would the Mac be a competitor platform? MS always has supported the Mac with their software. Then, it could be strategic. Consider the scenario in which the ARM based chips maintain a steady advantage vs. the x86-based chips. Microsoft then certainly wants to have a share of that market on Windows and not leave it exclusively to Mac OS. Considering how that depends on the availabilty of native ARM in software, they probably want to run on the one nice ARM implementation available on the desktop right now.
- kube-system 4y ago
  MS isn't a serious hardware company. They're a software and services company, and they make money when people use their software. Putting software on more devices is in their interest.
  - Pulcinella 4y ago
    Heck even with Xbox, I would point to GamePass as just further evidence of this. Microsoft wants you to purchase and use software/games for a Microsoft platform, not Microsoft hardware (the hardware is just there to facilitate the platform).
- artificialLimbs 4y ago
  They've already ported to ARM64. It is shockingly fast on my M1 MBP. Some software doesn't work, of course. You will need to be logged in with a "Windows Insider" account, which if I recall was fairly easy to sign up for. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windowsinsiderpreviewarm64 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windowsins...
- Tagbert 4y ago
  Competitors often work together when it benefits both participants. Competition is not a death-match.
ksec 4y ago
It isn't just about ARM. Either Apple or Microsoft would have to write all the M1 drivers specifically for Windows or else we wont see Windows 11 bootcamp working on ARM Macs. Edit: OK I will bite, will Apple be writing their Direct X drivers for their GPU to work on Windows 11?
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- altairprime 4y ago
  Apple continues to maintain Apple-signed Bootcamp drivers for the custom hardware in and around their Intel Macs, most recently adding support for their new external display when used on a Bootcamp Mac, so that’s certainly a plausible possibility. It’s somewhat likely they already have them completed and ready to ship.
- _ph_ 4y ago
  At minimum they could officially release Windows 11 for ARM so it can officially be used in a VM. That already works well. And if they really wanted, writing the drivers shouldn't be an obstacle that can't be overcome, just looking at the progress of Asahi Linux.
  - zozbot234 4y ago
    Asahi includes a UEFI-only implementation, so running Windows 11 under that is already quite possible at least in principle.
- GeekyBear 4y ago
  >Either Apple or Microsoft would have to write all the M1 drivers If Microsoft is selling Linux in a virtual machine as an acceptable solution for *nix software compatibility on Windows, why wouldn't running Windows ARM in a virtual machine be acceptable solution for Windows software compatibility on the Mac?

garaetjjte 4y ago

Why would they port Windows to their competitor platform?

mschuster91 4y ago
Apple and Microsoft have cooperated for years to bring Bootcamp on the x86 platform. Apple, no matter the OS, still makes a ton of margin on the hardware.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
dwaite 4y ago
On Microsoft's homepage (e.g. for a primary consumer focus), they list Windows behind Office 365 and behind the Xbox and Surface. For corporate use, they are pushing seats for O365 and other hosted services as well as selling Azure-based hosting. The loss of the mobile phone market and hits to the low end by Chrome OS means that pursuing a platform lock-in strategy is no longer viable.
- garaetjjte 4y ago
  >On Microsoft's homepage (e.g. for a primary consumer focus), they list Windows behind Office 365 and behind the Xbox and Surface. Windows consumer revenue comes from preinstalled licenses, they don't need to advertise it directly. M1 Windows port would be admitting defeat and kill Surface. For Office, they already have MacOS version of it.
  - kergonath 4y ago
    If they enable something like Boot Camp, those OEM licences would just be replaced by consumer ones, I am not sure it’d be much worse in terms of bottom line. Their Surface line has already tons of of competition from all the Wintel manufacturers anyway.
  - philistine 4y ago
    When you say it would kill Surface, are you 100% sure that all those corporatey types would stop buying those machines? Kill is a strong word.
- zamadatix 4y ago
  The platform lock-in strategy being no longer viable seems like a reason Windows wouldn't be ported, after all it IS the platform. Things like Office are already available for macOS and Apple isn't going to sell MS the M1 for Surface laptops.
_ph_ 4y ago
First of all, why would the Mac be a competitor platform? MS always has supported the Mac with their software. Then, it could be strategic. Consider the scenario in which the ARM based chips maintain a steady advantage vs. the x86-based chips. Microsoft then certainly wants to have a share of that market on Windows and not leave it exclusively to Mac OS. Considering how that depends on the availabilty of native ARM in software, they probably want to run on the one nice ARM implementation available on the desktop right now.
kube-system 4y ago
MS isn't a serious hardware company. They're a software and services company, and they make money when people use their software. Putting software on more devices is in their interest.
- Pulcinella 4y ago
  Heck even with Xbox, I would point to GamePass as just further evidence of this. Microsoft wants you to purchase and use software/games for a Microsoft platform, not Microsoft hardware (the hardware is just there to facilitate the platform).
artificialLimbs 4y ago
They've already ported to ARM64. It is shockingly fast on my M1 MBP. Some software doesn't work, of course. You will need to be logged in with a "Windows Insider" account, which if I recall was fairly easy to sign up for. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windowsinsiderpreviewarm64 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windowsins...
Tagbert 4y ago
Competitors often work together when it benefits both participants. Competition is not a death-match.

ksec 4y ago

It isn't just about ARM. Either Apple or Microsoft would have to write all the M1 drivers specifically for Windows or else we wont see Windows 11 bootcamp working on ARM Macs. Edit: OK I will bite, will Apple be writing their Direct X drivers for their GPU to work on Windows 11?

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
altairprime 4y ago
Apple continues to maintain Apple-signed Bootcamp drivers for the custom hardware in and around their Intel Macs, most recently adding support for their new external display when used on a Bootcamp Mac, so that’s certainly a plausible possibility. It’s somewhat likely they already have them completed and ready to ship.
_ph_ 4y ago
At minimum they could officially release Windows 11 for ARM so it can officially be used in a VM. That already works well. And if they really wanted, writing the drivers shouldn't be an obstacle that can't be overcome, just looking at the progress of Asahi Linux.
- zozbot234 4y ago
  Asahi includes a UEFI-only implementation, so running Windows 11 under that is already quite possible at least in principle.
GeekyBear 4y ago
>Either Apple or Microsoft would have to write all the M1 drivers If Microsoft is selling Linux in a virtual machine as an acceptable solution for *nix software compatibility on Windows, why wouldn't running Windows ARM in a virtual machine be acceptable solution for Windows software compatibility on the Mac?