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But this isn’t something you can just blame on tech workers. Big cities go through this constantly not only from tech expats but also from better paid local wor

by ErneX 5y ago

But this isn’t something you can just blame on tech workers. Big cities go through this constantly not only from tech expats but also from better paid local workers.

peoplefromibiza 5y ago
> Big cities go through this constantly No, they don't. Ask someone from Rome, Barcelona, Madrid even Warsaw, if they are happy of this airbnb-ization of their cities. [1] Anyway, cities are for citizens, not for freeloaders. [2] [1] https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/31/airbnb-sharing-economy-cities-barcelona-inequality-locals https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/31/airbnb... [2] The word city and the related civilization come from the Latin root civitas, originally meaning 'citizenship' or 'community member'
- gowld 5y ago
  Ask someone from NYC if they are happy with the Italianization of their city...
  - peoplefromibiza 5y ago
    I don't believe NY is being "italianized", Italians have been there for so long that the idea if Italians in NY it's almost a meme nowadays, even in Italy we mock them. Anyway, it's not about where people come from, but how. Italians didn't go to NY through Airbnb, profiting of their much higher salaries. They went there to work and lived at "the bottom of the ladder" level (my grand-grand father is one of them, he left Italy soon after the first World war). NY is also the most no-one-true-identity city I've ever lived in. First time I wenr there more than 20 years ago my biggest cultural shock was going to visit the Brooklyn zoo, catching a bus and being the only white person on the bus (well almost, I look more like a Northern African, but still). But I'm sure many in NY too aren't happy of the process that's going on.
    - TheGigaChad 4y ago
- manuelabeledo 4y ago
  I'm curious to know if short term rentals are an actual problem, compared to the much bigger, largely proven, and much less publicised, issue of hedge and investment funds buying out entire blocks of buildings. I myself lived in Madrid for 5-6 years, and what seemed to drive the cost of living up weren't the people owning one or two rental apartments, but corporations and banks buying entire buildings up. At least in Spain, there has been a connection between banks not making large chunks of their real estate stock available, and investment funds buying on the scarcity. > Anyway, cities are for citizens, not for freeloaders. This feels like a bit narrow sighted. While these workers you are talking about don't pay income taxes in these cities, they do pay other taxes (utilities, consumer products, etc.), and other than public infrastructure, they usually do not have free access to most services without paying (education, most healthcare). So who's "freeloading" here? I would admit that they pay less taxes, but that doesn't mean that they pay zero taxes. And another question arises. I myself am a Spaniard residing in the US. Would I be considered a "freeloader" if I go back to Spain and work for my employer in the US for a month or two? Do nationals get that consideration?

by ErneX 5y ago

But this isn’t something you can just blame on tech workers. Big cities go through this constantly not only from tech expats but also from better paid local workers.

peoplefromibiza 5y ago

> Big cities go through this constantly No, they don't. Ask someone from Rome, Barcelona, Madrid even Warsaw, if they are happy of this airbnb-ization of their cities. [1] Anyway, cities are for citizens, not for freeloaders. [2] [1] https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/31/airbnb-sharing-economy-cities-barcelona-inequality-locals https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/aug/31/airbnb... [2] The word city and the related civilization come from the Latin root civitas, originally meaning 'citizenship' or 'community member'

gowld 5y ago
Ask someone from NYC if they are happy with the Italianization of their city...
- peoplefromibiza 5y ago
  I don't believe NY is being "italianized", Italians have been there for so long that the idea if Italians in NY it's almost a meme nowadays, even in Italy we mock them. Anyway, it's not about where people come from, but how. Italians didn't go to NY through Airbnb, profiting of their much higher salaries. They went there to work and lived at "the bottom of the ladder" level (my grand-grand father is one of them, he left Italy soon after the first World war). NY is also the most no-one-true-identity city I've ever lived in. First time I wenr there more than 20 years ago my biggest cultural shock was going to visit the Brooklyn zoo, catching a bus and being the only white person on the bus (well almost, I look more like a Northern African, but still). But I'm sure many in NY too aren't happy of the process that's going on.
  - TheGigaChad 4y ago
manuelabeledo 4y ago
I'm curious to know if short term rentals are an actual problem, compared to the much bigger, largely proven, and much less publicised, issue of hedge and investment funds buying out entire blocks of buildings. I myself lived in Madrid for 5-6 years, and what seemed to drive the cost of living up weren't the people owning one or two rental apartments, but corporations and banks buying entire buildings up. At least in Spain, there has been a connection between banks not making large chunks of their real estate stock available, and investment funds buying on the scarcity. > Anyway, cities are for citizens, not for freeloaders. This feels like a bit narrow sighted. While these workers you are talking about don't pay income taxes in these cities, they do pay other taxes (utilities, consumer products, etc.), and other than public infrastructure, they usually do not have free access to most services without paying (education, most healthcare). So who's "freeloading" here? I would admit that they pay less taxes, but that doesn't mean that they pay zero taxes. And another question arises. I myself am a Spaniard residing in the US. Would I be considered a "freeloader" if I go back to Spain and work for my employer in the US for a month or two? Do nationals get that consideration?