7 ms·
It always annoyed me that they couldn't even be honest and say it was save rent, they had to make it seem like open floor plan was a positive thing because it "
by cube00 5y ago
It always annoyed me that they couldn't even be honest and say it was save rent, they had to make it seem like open floor plan was a positive thing because it "increases collaboration"
It's not enough you want to be cheap but you want to make it seem like you're doing it for our benefit.
- vmception 5y agoI think a lot of founders and their friends are using the office as a replacement for a healthier separate social circle and social life that they lack (a lot of people lack that, and they do too), so for them they're really just hanging out and like the potential for “increased collaboration” for that reason
- hindsightbias 5y agoWhatever people think of Myers-Briggs, the three I’ve been involved with the managers were always the extroverts. So your choice is WFH micromanaging or keeping that seat in the cube warm.
- sdoering 5y agoI don't understand the dichiotomy you're setting up here. > So your choice is WFH micromanaging or keeping that seat in the cube warm. Can't WFH work without micromanagement? At least I can say that I never felt more free than during the work from home phase in the pandemic.
- hindsightbias 4y agoWhen you’re 50 and have 10-50 reports, get back to us. :)
- PeterisP 5y agoI guess the point of that post is that the same type of managers who want to keep the cube seat warm are the same type of managers who'll want to micromanage WFH; switching to remote won't change their desires and expectations.
- cipheredStones 5y agoIntroversion/extroversion isn't a distinctive feature of Myers-Briggs - it shows up in more scientifically-respectable personality measures, like the five-factor (OCEAN) model.
- CamperBob2 5y agoIsn't it the very first letter?!
- dudeman13 5y agoI mean, Myers-Briggs is bollocks anyway so we shouldn't be using it for anything but funsies. I have a dream that one day we will shit hard on that sort of stuff instead of validating it. See also "alpha male".
- cipheredStones 5y agoYes, it features prominently in the MBTI, but my point is that "Whatever people think of Myers-Briggs [my experience is that extroversion is important]" doesn't make a lot of sense because introversion/extroversion is a widely-accepted concept that the MBTI uses, not a concept that comes from the MBTI.
- asiachick 5y ago(1) Healthiest = great social circle at work that bleeds into social circle out of work (2) Less healthy = great social circle at work, separate great social circle outside of work (3) Even less healthy = no social circle at work (just a job), great social circle outside work (4) Worse = great social circle at work, no social circle outside of work (I never seen this situation. If you have a great social circle at work it's practically inevitable you'll do things outside of work) (5) No social circle anywhere This being HN I know lots of people will rebel against (1) but there are tons of stories about friends starting companies together and you can be sure they loved spending time together both at work and outside of work. Just to make it more concrete I can't personally imagine The Beatles just calling their music "a job" and not getting close to their fellow band members. Sure that's a band but it's not really different from other famous business friend founders. I'm pretty confident Larry and Sergei socialized with each other outside of work. Hewlett and Packard. Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak were certainly friends when starting Apple and socialized outside work.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- idontpost 5y agoI'll be #5 no matter what. At least WFH I can see my daughter when I'm not working.
- asiachick 5y agoYou're not in situation (5), you're in (3).
- quickthrower2 5y agoSo 5 is basically “the hole” in prison?
- sateesh 5y agoI would put your choice (2) to be the healthiest. In my experience when you change jobs the social circle from work gradually atrophies.
- renewiltord 5y agoITT fish speculating about why birds fly and concluding that it’s because they don’t know how to swim.
- akhmatova 5y agoActually I think they were sufficiently self-deluded to believe that "increases collaboration" rap all along.
- mirntyfirty 5y agoHard to tell sometimes. Every now and again I meet some or that seems genuinely sincere while being corporate
- akhmatova 5y agoAgreed. It's like they don't really know what they believe.
- wardedVibe 5y agothe easiest way to lie to others is to lie to yourself and not look to critically at your reasoning.
- andrei_says_ 5y agoAnnouncing that it’s “for our benefit” over our screaming about how much we hate it and how harmful it is to comfort, productivity and deep work. It is beyond insulting.
- fsloth 5y agoAmen. Nobody has ever proved any benefits to open plan offices. Their pathologies however are well documented e.g. https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rstb.2017.0239 https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rstb.2017.023... Teams can thrive in same room. High cadence communication needs same room (NASA flight control). If the work is not actually about a team delivering value together - concretely, and the only rationale for open space is "hypothetically it would be nice if they collaborated more" open office will create negative multipliers to everything (except facility costs). The pathology is statistical. On average open offices are bad. Individuals can love and thrive in open offices. I suppose that's why it's so hard to kill them - you can always find a few persons who claim honestly it's the best place for them.
- sokoloff 5y agoThe benefit of open floor plan is very well established: you can get far more employees into a given amount of space (and therefore rent) than you can with cubes or offices.
- me_me_mu_mu 5y agoPretty sure the open office was a response to the cubicle hell that was prevalent in so many offices. As a child my dad took me to his bring your kid to work day. We sat in his cubicle all day and I felt like I was in prison. I feel bad that my dad had to deal with that BS. He went full remote as soon as he was able.
- raldi 5y agoYou're telling me that the reason sweatshops were designed around open floor plans had nothing to do with facilitating serendipitous interactions?! :O
- wollsmoth 5y agoMan I'd love a return to cubicles at the least. With enough space open floor plans can feel less terrible but sound just carries across these big open rooms.