4 ms·

> Right now I am on a six month wait to see a rheumatologist. Why? Capitalism. Typically that's anti-capitalist: there are very strong government and regulator

> Right now I am on a six month wait to see a rheumatologist. Why? Capitalism. Typically that's anti-capitalist: there are very strong government and regulatory limits on who can perform the services, and for self-serving reasons, they maintain shortages of supply. The free-market capitalist solution would be for prices to rise to a point where supply and demand are balanced, either by supply increasing (people switching fields), or reduced demand from prices rising.

ClumsyPilot 4y ago
> for prices to rise to a point where supply and demand are balanced Is there a limit to the amount of money you would pay to save your life? Is there a predatry loan you wouldn't take to pay for life-saving surgery for your child? Has this ever been demonstrated to work in healthcare in the real world, outside free-market fantasy land?
- WalterBright 4y ago
  Yes, in the US before the government took over health care. BTW, no government is going to spend unlimited sums to save your life.
  - FollowingTheDao 4y ago
    > Yes, in the US before the government took over health care. When did that happen? If you are thinking Obama care, uhm, no. > BTW, no government is going to spend unlimited sums to save your life. You are missing the point. Supply and demand curves break when it comes to life and death matters. That is why prices should not be dictated by a free market. Well, I guess that is fine if you are a sociopath.
    - WalterBright 4y ago
      > When did that happen? Not all at once, but decision by decision. One big change was when the AMA was granted a monopoly over the education of doctors. Then there was when companies got around wage controls in WW2 by tying health insurance to employment. Then in the 1960s there was enormous expansion of the FDA, and then Medicare and Medicaid. Then there were laws that required emergency rooms to treat people for free. All these measures sound great, but they completely mess with the structure of how markets work. And so we have the very expensive, and often dysfunctional, system today. > That is why prices should not be dictated by a free market. The free market doesn't dictate prices. Governments dictate prices, which always leads to shortages. > I guess that is fine if you are a sociopath. If you have a case, you should be able to make it without insults.
      - ClumsyPilot 4y ago
        Present your case - show that it worked well before government.
        WalterBright 4y ago
        The US had the longest life expectancy in the world.
  - throwaway675309 4y ago
    Might wanna go over your history again. https://youtube.com/watch?v=3qpLVTbVHnU&t=34s https://youtube.com/watch?v=3qpLVTbVHnU&t=34s The people who tend to be the most ardent defenders of private medical care are usually the same people who have had the fewest reasons to actually depend on it. They're also the same people that declare the United States the greatest country in the world despite having never lived anywhere else but the lower 48.
- tyrfing 4y ago
  The limit is approximately what you would be capable of paying. Putting value on life is a common practice, particularly in single-payer healthcare, mostly relevant to certain drugs. There are, of course, problems with a system like this. "I would pay literally everything to not die, but can't find treatment" is just not one (assuming certain values of everything), because people will take your money. Problems are things like rich people getting better treatment (happens just about no matter what, but we'd rather pretend otherwise), and evaluating treatment performance as a customer/patient (a reason for most supply restrictions.)

ClumsyPilot 4y ago

> for prices to rise to a point where supply and demand are balanced Is there a limit to the amount of money you would pay to save your life? Is there a predatry loan you wouldn't take to pay for life-saving surgery for your child? Has this ever been demonstrated to work in healthcare in the real world, outside free-market fantasy land?

WalterBright 4y ago
Yes, in the US before the government took over health care. BTW, no government is going to spend unlimited sums to save your life.
- FollowingTheDao 4y ago
  > Yes, in the US before the government took over health care. When did that happen? If you are thinking Obama care, uhm, no. > BTW, no government is going to spend unlimited sums to save your life. You are missing the point. Supply and demand curves break when it comes to life and death matters. That is why prices should not be dictated by a free market. Well, I guess that is fine if you are a sociopath.
  - WalterBright 4y ago
    > When did that happen? Not all at once, but decision by decision. One big change was when the AMA was granted a monopoly over the education of doctors. Then there was when companies got around wage controls in WW2 by tying health insurance to employment. Then in the 1960s there was enormous expansion of the FDA, and then Medicare and Medicaid. Then there were laws that required emergency rooms to treat people for free. All these measures sound great, but they completely mess with the structure of how markets work. And so we have the very expensive, and often dysfunctional, system today. > That is why prices should not be dictated by a free market. The free market doesn't dictate prices. Governments dictate prices, which always leads to shortages. > I guess that is fine if you are a sociopath. If you have a case, you should be able to make it without insults.
    - ClumsyPilot 4y ago
      Present your case - show that it worked well before government.
      - WalterBright 4y ago
        The US had the longest life expectancy in the world.
- throwaway675309 4y ago
  Might wanna go over your history again. https://youtube.com/watch?v=3qpLVTbVHnU&t=34s https://youtube.com/watch?v=3qpLVTbVHnU&t=34s The people who tend to be the most ardent defenders of private medical care are usually the same people who have had the fewest reasons to actually depend on it. They're also the same people that declare the United States the greatest country in the world despite having never lived anywhere else but the lower 48.
tyrfing 4y ago
The limit is approximately what you would be capable of paying. Putting value on life is a common practice, particularly in single-payer healthcare, mostly relevant to certain drugs. There are, of course, problems with a system like this. "I would pay literally everything to not die, but can't find treatment" is just not one (assuming certain values of everything), because people will take your money. Problems are things like rich people getting better treatment (happens just about no matter what, but we'd rather pretend otherwise), and evaluating treatment performance as a customer/patient (a reason for most supply restrictions.)