7 ms·

I'm still pissed at Google for locking the bootloader on my Pixel 2. I bought the phone unlocked directly from Google, specifically so that I could install a cu

I'm still pissed at Google for locking the bootloader on my Pixel 2. I bought the phone unlocked directly from Google, specifically so that I could install a custom ROM once Google stopped supporting it. But I sent the phone in to repair a broken USB port, and apparently it was Google's policy to send back a phone with a locked bootloader any time you get a repair. I can't even get a response from Google's support about the issue. (Although, based on what I've seen from other people in the same situation, the response would be pretty useless if I did get one.) I'm still using the phone, because the hardware is perfectly fine for my needs, but it's slowly turning into e-waste as the software gets more and more out of date. (I replaced the battery about a month before learning about the bootloader, so it's good for another 3-4 years.) Edit: I'm not the only one this happened to - see https://support.google.com/pixelphone/thread/14920605/google-refurbished-pixel-2-is-always-defective-bootloader-unlock?hl=en https://support.google.com/pixelphone/thread/14920605/google... and https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/73217322 https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/73217322 and https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/68897739 https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/68897739 and https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/rma-phone-from-google-is-not-unlocking-the-bootloader.3937931/ https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/rma-phone-from-google-is-... and https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/oem-unlocking-grayed-out-on-non-vzw-pixel-2.3776763/ https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/oem-unlocking-grayed-out-... and https://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/9xcdle/psa_rma_refurbished_pixel_2s_can_not_be/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/9xcdle/psa_rma_ref...

skellera 5y ago
Is that really their policy? Unlocked until it needs to be fixed? Seems like that’s worse than just locking it down in the first place.
- nfriedly 5y ago
  It was never a publicly stated policy and, anecdotally, they seem to have stopped doing it on newer phones. But one person escalated to a manager (because the first-level support staff didn't understand the difference between carrier unlocking and bootloader unlocking), and the manager stated that it was their policy. And, yeah, I agree that it's probably the worst of all situations. If I'd have known that a google repair would cut the phone's lifespan in half, I'd have just done the repair myself, or else hired someone local to do it.
  - cxr 5y ago
    Are you in the US? It doesn't solve the issue that you now have to deal with, but if you paid for the "repair" service, I'd have considered cancelling the payment through my bank.
    - nfriedly 5y ago
      I am in the US. It was a free repair (covered by the warranty), and I didn't realize the bootloader lock issue until a couple of years later. (I was running stock firmware at the time - it's only been since google dropped support for the phone that I tried to upgrade to a third-party firmware.)
    - slavik81 5y ago
      Is that safe? I would assume that disputing a transaction with Google would get you locked out of all Google services.
- woleium 5y ago
  I doubt it is intentional. I heard they'll fix it if you contact them
JohnTHaller 5y ago
Did they send you back a Verizon phone? Verizon Pixels have locked bootloaders due to Verizon's own policies. They say they are "unlocked" but they only mean carrier-wise. Source: Owned a Verizon Pixel 1 that I sold due to it having a locked bootloader. Anecdotally, I purchased a 4a 5g from Google with a dead headphone jack. My replacement also had an unlocked bootloader though I think it was also new.
- nfriedly 5y ago
  It was not branded as a Verizon model, but it seems to have the Verizon behavior of carrier unlocked, bootloader locked (and not unlockable). Based on anecdotes like yours, I believe Google stopped doing it after the Pixel 2, but that doesn't help me.
  - ttarr 5y ago
    I don't think they stopped, my Pixel 3 XL is locked also in the same manner.
    - woleium 5y ago
      you can contact them and they will replace it with an unlocked one
- joemazerino 5y ago
  Google refurbs are bootloader locked. Probably old Verizon stock
baisq 5y ago
You can’t unlock it? I got back a locked phone when I got mine repaired but I could unlock it just like I did with the one I sent them.
- nfriedly 5y ago
  Yes. Was yours a Pixel 2? I'm not the only one to experience this issue, see https://support.google.com/pixelphone/thread/14920605/google-refurbished-pixel-2-is-always-defective-bootloader-unlock?hl=en https://support.google.com/pixelphone/thread/14920605/google... and https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/73217322 https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/73217322 and https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/68897739 https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/68897739
  - baisq 5y ago
    I see. Mine was a 2 XL. Probably not the same exactly
orangepurple 5y ago
When you run out of uses for your smart phone you can always convert it to a wifi LAN camera using IP Webcam by Pavel Khlebovich and consume the output in VLC. I have been using an old phone for this purpose successfully for years.
- nfriedly 5y ago
  In general, I'm pretty aggressive about reselling or giving away old hardware when I no longer use it. But I do appreciate innovative uses like that, and I wouldn't be surprised to hear that some previous phone of mine is serving as a LAN camera for someone else :)
- ajsnigrutin 5y ago
  Is it running 24/7? How is the camera (sensor) holding on? Is the image quality still ok? I had the same plans, but I was always afraid that running the camera for a long(-er) time will degrade the sensor fast, so te phones are collecting dust in a drawer now :)
  - hanselot 5y ago
    On Christmas morning we had a break-in at our house. Since then have been using an old droid connected to wifi as IP Webcam (I even bought pro actually) There are enough settings to allow for just about any use-case. For me, I had issues doing full HD over wifi, since the router is upstairs in a different room, but you can play around with settings for resolution and FPS until you find something stable enough for your setup. The heating seems okay, leave it on 24/7 with no downtime. Occasionally the phone falls off the wall due to the advanced taping mechanism keeping it there, but that's not the software's fault. You can have it automatically run at boot. We have load shedding here often, and the phone recharges quickly enough after the 2 hour shutdown of power and can stream throughout (connected to mobile hotspot wifi - also for loadshedding reasons) I don't buy many apps, but this one I recommend for sure.
- deno 5y ago
  This is less useful than it sounds because there’s no integrated night vision, unlike even the cheapest ip cams. So really only works as a webcam.
p1mrx 5y ago
Yeah, I'm in the same boat; so is this guy: https://jacobhall.net/2022/01/29/000177 https://jacobhall.net/2022/01/29/000177 I google "flashing unlock is not allowed" every few months, but there's nothing new to try.
uneekname 5y ago
The same thing happened to me, and I wrote an angry blog post about it[0] It is not OK for Google to lock me out of a phone that I own! LineageOS (running on a different device) has changed the game for me. It has been a smoother, more accessible Android experience, and I'm so grateful to the developers who make it happen. [0] https://jacobhall.net/2022/01/29/000177 https://jacobhall.net/2022/01/29/000177
- chasil 5y ago
  Unfortunately, Lineage has abandoned a large number of previously-supported devices, so this latest version will be met with some dismay. The primary reason is the loss of iptables, and the older kernels that do not support eBPF. U.S. carriers are also moving to VoLTE, and this is not supported on any Samsung devices at all. AT&T has already made the move, and published a list of allowed devices. It's sad to see them go.
  - zozbot234 5y ago
    > Unfortunately, Lineage has abandoned a large number of previously-supported devices, so this latest version will be met with some dismay. > The primary reason is the loss of iptables, and the older kernels that do not support eBPF. It's worth noting that the pmOS folks are working on mainline kernel support for older devices. This is not always easy, since e.g. some devices are only supported via non-free kernel or userspace blobs. But good quality hardware might regain support at some point. If you have devices that are going unsupported because of this issue, you might want to experiment with porting them to a mainline kernel by following the instructions on the pmOS wiki.
- daqhris 5y ago
  Unrelated to the topic we're discussing, I just wanted to say that your website is super cool. Its design is so simple and appealing to my minimalist taste (and I noticed that it's open-sourced). Fantastic job!
  - uneekname 5y ago
soperj 5y ago
This sounds like it's class-action worthy.
- nfriedly 5y ago
  You're not wrong, although I'd be a little hesitant to start that because my job is somewhat dependent on being in google's good graces (and I've definitely heard of entire companies being banned when a single employee - or even former employee's - account gets flagged.) Also, I find it unlikely that we could compel google to do the right thing and unlock everyone's phones, even if we won. I think the more likely outcome would be a small monetary compensation that was hardly worth anyone's time (except for the lawyers).
  - realusername 5y ago
    > I'd be a little hesitant to start that because my job is somewhat dependent on being in google's good graces It's clearly becoming mafia-like, you are afraid of them just because of their reach.
  - soperj 5y ago
    >small monetary compensation that was hardly worth anyone's time (except for the lawyers) I've definitely had this stance in the past, but at the same time, where there is no repercussion for the company doing this kind of stuff, it just makes them(and others) more open to it in the future.
- MaxBarraclough 4y ago
  For comparison there was a successful class action against Sony for removing Linux support from the PS3 in an online update. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OtherOS https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OtherOS
deng 5y ago
I can guess what the reason for this is: probably every phone that leaves Google must pass SafetyNet, and an unlocked bootloader will make SafetyNet fail. This cannot be circumvented, see this thread from the Magisk developer: https://nitter.net/topjohnwu/status/1237830555523149824 https://nitter.net/topjohnwu/status/1237830555523149824
- nfriedly 5y ago
  I should probably have clarified that I expected an unlockable phone, not an unlocked one. Unlockable meaning that it is still locked, and still passes SafteyNet, but I can flip the switch in developer options and run the fastboot command and then unlock it. That capability is what they took away. IMO, that shouldn't cause SafteyNet to fail either, but that's a different issue... Also, the phone was bought in 2017, and the repair happened in 2018, so I think all of it predates that SafteyNet tightening.
Vladimof 5y ago
While that stinks, I purchased not too long ago a used Google Pixel 3 for about $70 on Swappa.com and have been happily running LineageOS without GAPPS ever since. I didn't know that 19.1 was released until now but it looks like it can't be installed using the updater on that phone.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
kelnos 5y ago
I wonder if you could take Google to small claims court to get some kind of monetary compensation from them. You'd have to figure out how to explain what a locked bootloader is in judge-friendly terms, though. Then again, Google would probably terminate your Google Account if you did this. And good luck suing Google for retaliation...
- nfriedly 5y ago
  Yeah, someone else suggested a class action, but as you said, retaliation is likely, and I've heard of Google banning entire businesses because an ex-employee's account got flagged, and I just don't want to risk that. Also, given that you can get a used pixel 2 for under $100, I doubt it'd be worth the trouble in the first place.

skellera 5y ago

Is that really their policy? Unlocked until it needs to be fixed? Seems like that’s worse than just locking it down in the first place.

nfriedly 5y ago
It was never a publicly stated policy and, anecdotally, they seem to have stopped doing it on newer phones. But one person escalated to a manager (because the first-level support staff didn't understand the difference between carrier unlocking and bootloader unlocking), and the manager stated that it was their policy. And, yeah, I agree that it's probably the worst of all situations. If I'd have known that a google repair would cut the phone's lifespan in half, I'd have just done the repair myself, or else hired someone local to do it.
- cxr 5y ago
  Are you in the US? It doesn't solve the issue that you now have to deal with, but if you paid for the "repair" service, I'd have considered cancelling the payment through my bank.
  - nfriedly 5y ago
    I am in the US. It was a free repair (covered by the warranty), and I didn't realize the bootloader lock issue until a couple of years later. (I was running stock firmware at the time - it's only been since google dropped support for the phone that I tried to upgrade to a third-party firmware.)
  - slavik81 5y ago
    Is that safe? I would assume that disputing a transaction with Google would get you locked out of all Google services.
woleium 5y ago
I doubt it is intentional. I heard they'll fix it if you contact them

JohnTHaller 5y ago

Did they send you back a Verizon phone? Verizon Pixels have locked bootloaders due to Verizon's own policies. They say they are "unlocked" but they only mean carrier-wise. Source: Owned a Verizon Pixel 1 that I sold due to it having a locked bootloader. Anecdotally, I purchased a 4a 5g from Google with a dead headphone jack. My replacement also had an unlocked bootloader though I think it was also new.

nfriedly 5y ago
It was not branded as a Verizon model, but it seems to have the Verizon behavior of carrier unlocked, bootloader locked (and not unlockable). Based on anecdotes like yours, I believe Google stopped doing it after the Pixel 2, but that doesn't help me.
- ttarr 5y ago
  I don't think they stopped, my Pixel 3 XL is locked also in the same manner.
  - woleium 5y ago
    you can contact them and they will replace it with an unlocked one
joemazerino 5y ago
Google refurbs are bootloader locked. Probably old Verizon stock

baisq 5y ago

You can’t unlock it? I got back a locked phone when I got mine repaired but I could unlock it just like I did with the one I sent them.

nfriedly 5y ago
Yes. Was yours a Pixel 2? I'm not the only one to experience this issue, see https://support.google.com/pixelphone/thread/14920605/google-refurbished-pixel-2-is-always-defective-bootloader-unlock?hl=en https://support.google.com/pixelphone/thread/14920605/google... and https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/73217322 https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/73217322 and https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/68897739 https://issuetracker.google.com/issues/68897739
- baisq 5y ago
  I see. Mine was a 2 XL. Probably not the same exactly

orangepurple 5y ago

When you run out of uses for your smart phone you can always convert it to a wifi LAN camera using IP Webcam by Pavel Khlebovich and consume the output in VLC. I have been using an old phone for this purpose successfully for years.

nfriedly 5y ago
In general, I'm pretty aggressive about reselling or giving away old hardware when I no longer use it. But I do appreciate innovative uses like that, and I wouldn't be surprised to hear that some previous phone of mine is serving as a LAN camera for someone else :)
ajsnigrutin 5y ago
Is it running 24/7? How is the camera (sensor) holding on? Is the image quality still ok? I had the same plans, but I was always afraid that running the camera for a long(-er) time will degrade the sensor fast, so te phones are collecting dust in a drawer now :)
- hanselot 5y ago
  On Christmas morning we had a break-in at our house. Since then have been using an old droid connected to wifi as IP Webcam (I even bought pro actually) There are enough settings to allow for just about any use-case. For me, I had issues doing full HD over wifi, since the router is upstairs in a different room, but you can play around with settings for resolution and FPS until you find something stable enough for your setup. The heating seems okay, leave it on 24/7 with no downtime. Occasionally the phone falls off the wall due to the advanced taping mechanism keeping it there, but that's not the software's fault. You can have it automatically run at boot. We have load shedding here often, and the phone recharges quickly enough after the 2 hour shutdown of power and can stream throughout (connected to mobile hotspot wifi - also for loadshedding reasons) I don't buy many apps, but this one I recommend for sure.
deno 5y ago
This is less useful than it sounds because there’s no integrated night vision, unlike even the cheapest ip cams. So really only works as a webcam.

p1mrx 5y ago

Yeah, I'm in the same boat; so is this guy: https://jacobhall.net/2022/01/29/000177 https://jacobhall.net/2022/01/29/000177 I google "flashing unlock is not allowed" every few months, but there's nothing new to try.

uneekname 5y ago

The same thing happened to me, and I wrote an angry blog post about it[0] It is not OK for Google to lock me out of a phone that I own! LineageOS (running on a different device) has changed the game for me. It has been a smoother, more accessible Android experience, and I'm so grateful to the developers who make it happen. [0] https://jacobhall.net/2022/01/29/000177 https://jacobhall.net/2022/01/29/000177

chasil 5y ago
Unfortunately, Lineage has abandoned a large number of previously-supported devices, so this latest version will be met with some dismay. The primary reason is the loss of iptables, and the older kernels that do not support eBPF. U.S. carriers are also moving to VoLTE, and this is not supported on any Samsung devices at all. AT&T has already made the move, and published a list of allowed devices. It's sad to see them go.
- zozbot234 5y ago
  > Unfortunately, Lineage has abandoned a large number of previously-supported devices, so this latest version will be met with some dismay. > The primary reason is the loss of iptables, and the older kernels that do not support eBPF. It's worth noting that the pmOS folks are working on mainline kernel support for older devices. This is not always easy, since e.g. some devices are only supported via non-free kernel or userspace blobs. But good quality hardware might regain support at some point. If you have devices that are going unsupported because of this issue, you might want to experiment with porting them to a mainline kernel by following the instructions on the pmOS wiki.
daqhris 5y ago
Unrelated to the topic we're discussing, I just wanted to say that your website is super cool. Its design is so simple and appealing to my minimalist taste (and I noticed that it's open-sourced). Fantastic job!
- uneekname 5y ago

soperj 5y ago

This sounds like it's class-action worthy.

nfriedly 5y ago
You're not wrong, although I'd be a little hesitant to start that because my job is somewhat dependent on being in google's good graces (and I've definitely heard of entire companies being banned when a single employee - or even former employee's - account gets flagged.) Also, I find it unlikely that we could compel google to do the right thing and unlock everyone's phones, even if we won. I think the more likely outcome would be a small monetary compensation that was hardly worth anyone's time (except for the lawyers).
- realusername 5y ago
  > I'd be a little hesitant to start that because my job is somewhat dependent on being in google's good graces It's clearly becoming mafia-like, you are afraid of them just because of their reach.
- soperj 5y ago
  >small monetary compensation that was hardly worth anyone's time (except for the lawyers) I've definitely had this stance in the past, but at the same time, where there is no repercussion for the company doing this kind of stuff, it just makes them(and others) more open to it in the future.
MaxBarraclough 4y ago
For comparison there was a successful class action against Sony for removing Linux support from the PS3 in an online update. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OtherOS https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OtherOS

deng 5y ago

I can guess what the reason for this is: probably every phone that leaves Google must pass SafetyNet, and an unlocked bootloader will make SafetyNet fail. This cannot be circumvented, see this thread from the Magisk developer: https://nitter.net/topjohnwu/status/1237830555523149824 https://nitter.net/topjohnwu/status/1237830555523149824

nfriedly 5y ago
I should probably have clarified that I expected an unlockable phone, not an unlocked one. Unlockable meaning that it is still locked, and still passes SafteyNet, but I can flip the switch in developer options and run the fastboot command and then unlock it. That capability is what they took away. IMO, that shouldn't cause SafteyNet to fail either, but that's a different issue... Also, the phone was bought in 2017, and the repair happened in 2018, so I think all of it predates that SafteyNet tightening.

Vladimof 5y ago

While that stinks, I purchased not too long ago a used Google Pixel 3 for about $70 on Swappa.com and have been happily running LineageOS without GAPPS ever since. I didn't know that 19.1 was released until now but it looks like it can't be installed using the updater on that phone.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

kelnos 5y ago

I wonder if you could take Google to small claims court to get some kind of monetary compensation from them. You'd have to figure out how to explain what a locked bootloader is in judge-friendly terms, though. Then again, Google would probably terminate your Google Account if you did this. And good luck suing Google for retaliation...

nfriedly 5y ago
Yeah, someone else suggested a class action, but as you said, retaliation is likely, and I've heard of Google banning entire businesses because an ex-employee's account got flagged, and I just don't want to risk that. Also, given that you can get a used pixel 2 for under $100, I doubt it'd be worth the trouble in the first place.