4 ms·

Starting out with smearing as qanon, far right etc demonstrate that you are an adherent of repressive tolerance. This is a labeling of viewpoint opponents as be

Starting out with smearing as qanon, far right etc demonstrate that you are an adherent of repressive tolerance. This is a labeling of viewpoint opponents as beyond the pale using appeals to emotion (pathos) without evidence, instead of or in addition to engaging in appeals to reason (logos). It’s a cheap trick when used like this. With regards to this specific paper, you say yourself the methods paper is peer reviewed. It’s also been cited 470 times according to Google scholar, which is an academic home run. Will a methods paper apply the methodology at scale? Look at his follow up papers for that. The point on scale is fair if true, but the paper Slate criticize is a methodology paper which is not where you would expect a large scale study. I haven’t read his body of work to get a full picture of that question, and it’s not clear to me that Slate did so either. No matter what Slate is an activist publication that at times misrepresent to support a predetermined conclusion.

cromwellian 4y ago
I'm simply stating facts, Epoch Times is not a reliable source. And as the Slate article pointed out, his 7 pages of citations were all his own articles and only one citation was Peer Reviewed in a journal with any credibility. Slate's criticisms were factual, they are of course biased, but so what? This study's statistical parameters are really shoddy, and just straight up bad data. Garbage in, garbage out. His PNAS original study had a larger sample, but again, the conclusions don't really follow, and there are many more explanatory effects for how search behaves (including his own point about how searches can create band-wagoning and reinforcing behavior), and the claims that it shift votes are not established. One only has to imagine that if more voters are searching for Clinton and clicking Ads or the first few SERP results, then the search engine might take that as a signal to return MORE of those results, which causes more people to do follow up searches for Clinton info, establishing a positive-feedback loop without any BS about tech companies putting their foot on the balance. We've in fact seen this behavior before, famously when Microsoft's Bing started returning search results for documents it couldn't possibly have crawled, simply due to click-tracking. Plus, the sheer fact that a majority of world wide media were against Trump, Google's crawler is going to end up with a lot of pro-Clinton content. I'm not just talking about US mainstream media and newspapers, but UK, French, German, Canadian, Australian, you name it, a majority of the media did not like Trump. The search engines can only deal with the data they're crawling and the user behavior they're receiving. I know it comes as a shock, but a majority of not just Americans, but the Western world did not have a high opinion of Trump in 2016. You don't need to invent elaborate tech conspiracies to end up with pro-Clinton or Trump-critical articles getting surfaced since that was the actual Zeitgeist. It's amazing to me that even after winning in 2016, Trump and his cadre were still sore that Clinton won the popular vote. Well, newsflash, but the Democrats have been winning the popular vote pretty much every election. Add up all of the votes House & Senate members got, and you'll see far more Democratic votes, because the GOP generally represents lower population density districts. Again, not surprising. The GOP could use that information to decide they need to change policies to attract different demographics, and widen their audience, but it seems like in the post-Trump era, it's down to claiming vote fraud, media bias, and doubling down on populism and weird stuff about their opponents being Groomers or CRT theorists. It's honesty sad, because the GOP used to run some campaigns on issues that had cross cultural appeal, like crime reduction, but now it's all weird culture war stuff.
- asabjorn 4y ago
  > The GOP could use that information to decide they need to change policies to attract different demographics, and widen their audience I agree the GOP fails at providing a policy alternative. That is undoubtedly true, but it’s not clear it will remain so. That said look at how Hispanics in polls are moving heavily towards GOP. But gaining votes by just not being democrat and putting on a pretense of not supporting the woke policies is not a stable way to shift coalitions. > weird stuff about their opponents being Groomers or CRT theorists. More than 50% of the second biggest teacher union voted to teach CRT even in states where it’s illegal. I’ll summarize why a few popular activist teaching tools accurately fit the term grooming. Queer theory as praxised in schools seek to teach the student to deconstruct their sexual identity and interpret it in an oppressor/oppresssed dynamic. Goal isn’t to acknowledge and stabilize a sexual identity, but to destabilize the kid sexually into constantly engaging in a critical introspection of their sexuality as a Marxist activist. Queer theory seek to destabilize in the vulnerable stage when the kid is learning that they are a sexual being. This was piloted by Lukacs in the Hungarian communist revolution. CRT does the same as queer theory, but for race. Critical pedagogy (SEL, the other CRT etc) that is applied across almost all schools instead of teaching skill, teach the student to interpret the words and math through their personal emotion applying the Marxist process to find the oppressor/oppressed dynamic instead of skill. Paulo Freire that invented critical pedagogy, like all Marxists, view skills teaching as evil because it at best train people to take on roles in the meritocratic system they deem evil. In Marxist theology skilled people manifest the status quo reality through false consciousness. They believe a skilled person act like a robot based upon instructions of dead people. Critical pedagogy results in a huge expected drop in functional literacy in high school graduates, that means they can not read words on a page and understand what the sentences mean, and the math skills are dropping in the same way. That’s not surprising when you spend school talking about how you feel about a subject instead of how to establish a shared interpretation and practicing skill. SEL is a super evil corruption of group psychology techniques by teachers unlicensed in psychology to break kids resistance to the teachers activism. Why should we allow Marxist teachers to indoctrinate in Marxist process instead of teaching skill?
  - cromwellian 4y ago

cromwellian 4y ago

I'm simply stating facts, Epoch Times is not a reliable source. And as the Slate article pointed out, his 7 pages of citations were all his own articles and only one citation was Peer Reviewed in a journal with any credibility. Slate's criticisms were factual, they are of course biased, but so what? This study's statistical parameters are really shoddy, and just straight up bad data. Garbage in, garbage out. His PNAS original study had a larger sample, but again, the conclusions don't really follow, and there are many more explanatory effects for how search behaves (including his own point about how searches can create band-wagoning and reinforcing behavior), and the claims that it shift votes are not established. One only has to imagine that if more voters are searching for Clinton and clicking Ads or the first few SERP results, then the search engine might take that as a signal to return MORE of those results, which causes more people to do follow up searches for Clinton info, establishing a positive-feedback loop without any BS about tech companies putting their foot on the balance. We've in fact seen this behavior before, famously when Microsoft's Bing started returning search results for documents it couldn't possibly have crawled, simply due to click-tracking. Plus, the sheer fact that a majority of world wide media were against Trump, Google's crawler is going to end up with a lot of pro-Clinton content. I'm not just talking about US mainstream media and newspapers, but UK, French, German, Canadian, Australian, you name it, a majority of the media did not like Trump. The search engines can only deal with the data they're crawling and the user behavior they're receiving. I know it comes as a shock, but a majority of not just Americans, but the Western world did not have a high opinion of Trump in 2016. You don't need to invent elaborate tech conspiracies to end up with pro-Clinton or Trump-critical articles getting surfaced since that was the actual Zeitgeist. It's amazing to me that even after winning in 2016, Trump and his cadre were still sore that Clinton won the popular vote. Well, newsflash, but the Democrats have been winning the popular vote pretty much every election. Add up all of the votes House & Senate members got, and you'll see far more Democratic votes, because the GOP generally represents lower population density districts. Again, not surprising. The GOP could use that information to decide they need to change policies to attract different demographics, and widen their audience, but it seems like in the post-Trump era, it's down to claiming vote fraud, media bias, and doubling down on populism and weird stuff about their opponents being Groomers or CRT theorists. It's honesty sad, because the GOP used to run some campaigns on issues that had cross cultural appeal, like crime reduction, but now it's all weird culture war stuff.

asabjorn 4y ago
> The GOP could use that information to decide they need to change policies to attract different demographics, and widen their audience I agree the GOP fails at providing a policy alternative. That is undoubtedly true, but it’s not clear it will remain so. That said look at how Hispanics in polls are moving heavily towards GOP. But gaining votes by just not being democrat and putting on a pretense of not supporting the woke policies is not a stable way to shift coalitions. > weird stuff about their opponents being Groomers or CRT theorists. More than 50% of the second biggest teacher union voted to teach CRT even in states where it’s illegal. I’ll summarize why a few popular activist teaching tools accurately fit the term grooming. Queer theory as praxised in schools seek to teach the student to deconstruct their sexual identity and interpret it in an oppressor/oppresssed dynamic. Goal isn’t to acknowledge and stabilize a sexual identity, but to destabilize the kid sexually into constantly engaging in a critical introspection of their sexuality as a Marxist activist. Queer theory seek to destabilize in the vulnerable stage when the kid is learning that they are a sexual being. This was piloted by Lukacs in the Hungarian communist revolution. CRT does the same as queer theory, but for race. Critical pedagogy (SEL, the other CRT etc) that is applied across almost all schools instead of teaching skill, teach the student to interpret the words and math through their personal emotion applying the Marxist process to find the oppressor/oppressed dynamic instead of skill. Paulo Freire that invented critical pedagogy, like all Marxists, view skills teaching as evil because it at best train people to take on roles in the meritocratic system they deem evil. In Marxist theology skilled people manifest the status quo reality through false consciousness. They believe a skilled person act like a robot based upon instructions of dead people. Critical pedagogy results in a huge expected drop in functional literacy in high school graduates, that means they can not read words on a page and understand what the sentences mean, and the math skills are dropping in the same way. That’s not surprising when you spend school talking about how you feel about a subject instead of how to establish a shared interpretation and practicing skill. SEL is a super evil corruption of group psychology techniques by teachers unlicensed in psychology to break kids resistance to the teachers activism. Why should we allow Marxist teachers to indoctrinate in Marxist process instead of teaching skill?
- cromwellian 4y ago