2 ms·

You didn’t answer my question, which suggests your argument is not in good faith. The authority figure angle is interesting, though, especially in the case of

You didn’t answer my question, which suggests your argument is not in good faith. The authority figure angle is interesting, though, especially in the case of one of the children I mentioned who has a cisgendered twin of the same biological sex. Seems weird the parents would push it on one child and not the other… …or, it could just be as simple as you being wrong. Maybe even intentionally so. I don’t know. Regardless I’m not interested in responding to you any more after this because I don’t have time for bad faith actors.

twofornone 4y ago
>You didn’t answer my question, which suggests your argument is not in good faith. Well isn't that ironic, considering you didn't answer mine in the GP. I'll tell you what is bad faith though, your shallow accusation as a substitute for an argument. What exactly are you implying with this accusation anyway? >Seems weird the parents would push it on one child and not the other It's not necessarily being "pushed" onto them, but excessive encouragement and failure to intervene - and I'm not implying that they've done anything out of selfish reasons (though transgenderism absolutely confers clout in certain circles these days).
- howinteresting 4y ago
  Failure to intervene in what? Any attempt to make a trans kid cis is conversion therapy. Gender identity is part of the core of personhood, and is (a) resistant to external pressure to change, and more importantly (b) ought not be changed.
- mike00632 4y ago
  To be clear, people don't come out as trans for clout. Trans people are still at a higher risk of suicide and being murdered thanks to people like you.
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  - twofornone 4y ago
    What I'm alleging is that the condition is overdiagnosed because the symptoms mimic other disorders and people absolutely seek out victimhood for clout given 1. The state of the progressive movement, where underprivilege is used to justify special treatment 2. Specific dynamics of the LGBT and especially trans community, which psychologically incentivises entry and continued participation, in the same way as a gang or cult. Complete with a flavor of excommunication for detransitioners who are accused of bigotry for saying exactly the sort of things I'm saying. What about their lived experiences? 3. The [false] promise that a troubled teen can effectively reinvent himself and become the person they want to be with pills and surgery. It's common for teens to desire to be someone else. The clout angle isn't unique to gender dysphoria either - teenagers self diagnose with all kinds of trendy disorders in certain circles, and when I was in HS it wasn't transgenderism but bisexuality that people latched onto as a fashionable form of rebellion. Difference being we didn't give them affirmative therapy and HRT. Sorry, but acknowledging that the incentives are perverse does not make me a bigot, and such accusations only serve to derail the discussion. Perhaps parents wouldn't be up in arms if this wasn't the default response to criticism. Edit: also, the whole trans murder thing is a myth and perpetuating it helps no one. https://quillette.com/2019/12/07/are-we-in-the-midst-of-a-transgender-murder-epidemic/ https://quillette.com/2019/12/07/are-we-in-the-midst-of-a-tr...
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      [deleted]

twofornone 4y ago

>You didn’t answer my question, which suggests your argument is not in good faith. Well isn't that ironic, considering you didn't answer mine in the GP. I'll tell you what is bad faith though, your shallow accusation as a substitute for an argument. What exactly are you implying with this accusation anyway? >Seems weird the parents would push it on one child and not the other It's not necessarily being "pushed" onto them, but excessive encouragement and failure to intervene - and I'm not implying that they've done anything out of selfish reasons (though transgenderism absolutely confers clout in certain circles these days).

howinteresting 4y ago
Failure to intervene in what? Any attempt to make a trans kid cis is conversion therapy. Gender identity is part of the core of personhood, and is (a) resistant to external pressure to change, and more importantly (b) ought not be changed.
mike00632 4y ago
To be clear, people don't come out as trans for clout. Trans people are still at a higher risk of suicide and being murdered thanks to people like you.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- twofornone 4y ago
  What I'm alleging is that the condition is overdiagnosed because the symptoms mimic other disorders and people absolutely seek out victimhood for clout given 1. The state of the progressive movement, where underprivilege is used to justify special treatment 2. Specific dynamics of the LGBT and especially trans community, which psychologically incentivises entry and continued participation, in the same way as a gang or cult. Complete with a flavor of excommunication for detransitioners who are accused of bigotry for saying exactly the sort of things I'm saying. What about their lived experiences? 3. The [false] promise that a troubled teen can effectively reinvent himself and become the person they want to be with pills and surgery. It's common for teens to desire to be someone else. The clout angle isn't unique to gender dysphoria either - teenagers self diagnose with all kinds of trendy disorders in certain circles, and when I was in HS it wasn't transgenderism but bisexuality that people latched onto as a fashionable form of rebellion. Difference being we didn't give them affirmative therapy and HRT. Sorry, but acknowledging that the incentives are perverse does not make me a bigot, and such accusations only serve to derail the discussion. Perhaps parents wouldn't be up in arms if this wasn't the default response to criticism. Edit: also, the whole trans murder thing is a myth and perpetuating it helps no one. https://quillette.com/2019/12/07/are-we-in-the-midst-of-a-transgender-murder-epidemic/ https://quillette.com/2019/12/07/are-we-in-the-midst-of-a-tr...
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]