3 ms·

Even the most hardcore linux enthusiasts that tried the pinephone claim that they can not reliably make calls, have constant crashes and the app ecosystem is li

Even the most hardcore linux enthusiasts that tried the pinephone claim that they can not reliably make calls, have constant crashes and the app ecosystem is limited. If you are okay with not being able to reliably make calls, fine, but don't oversell on the definition of "daily driver". > You can't upgrade Linux on your phone due to the proprietary drivers. Hardware-specific binary blobs don't stop the UBPorts devs to make constant updates to my old BenQ phone. The software part is still up-to-date, but the application catalog is almost non-existent, the hardware is limited (1GB RAM) and the camera is shit. Eventually I want to turn that device into a networked music player, but as a smartphone it didn't last two years. If I manage to get 7 years out of this Fairphone, its ROI will have been unbelievably great, I will gladly buy whatever comes from Fairphone in 2027, and I will try to find another use for this device. Hopefully by then Linux on mobile will have matured, but I don't need to compromise on my actual needs just to please the FOSS-purists.

fsflover 5y ago
> If you are okay with not being able to reliably make calls, fine, but don't oversell on the definition of "daily driver" This is an outdated information. The development pace of Pinephone is unprecedented. Even here on HN I saw many recent posts saying that calls and MMS work fine already.
- rglullis 5y ago
  Ok, good to know. Too bad that I needed a phone 10 months ago. Update: reading through https://www.reddit.com/r/pinephone/comments/u6zzyc/how_pinephone_sucks_at_daily_use/ https://www.reddit.com/r/pinephone/comments/u6zzyc/how_pinep... (from 6 days ago) it seems like you are not just overselling hard, you are trying to convince people to switch to something that is absolutely not ready for general consumption. You do realize that if your goal is to get more people to adopt FOSS, your approach is more harmful than beneficial? Don't make promises that you can not keep, it will burn whatever goodwill people might have and it ends up convincing them Linux is never going to be for them.
  - fsflover 5y ago
    Yes, it's not ready for general consumption. Mainly due to the battery life (I use two batteries) and sluggishness (it's fast if you use non-mainstream Sxmo). For Librem 5 (which I also preordered) both these points are fine (well, the battery is still worse than for Android). Note that we are not on Reddit but on HN. Is its audience ordinary people? My goal is to bring more technical people to GNU/Linux phones.
    - rglullis 5y ago
      HN audience is large and diverse enough to the point that it makes no sense to think as some homogeneous group of people who are interested in tinkering with their phones. By making absurd claims about the feasibility of the Pinephone as a daily driver, you are doing a disservice to your own community. Also, is your goal to get people to use GNU/Linux phones or is it to maximize the overall adoption of Free Software? The former requires a radical shift in consumer behavior and will be unlikely to happen, the latter can be done in gradual steps with a much higher chance of success. Think of it this way: if you manage to upset me, who is pretty much in favor of F/LOSS, imagine how many bridges you burned with those "on the other side"?
      - fsflover 5y ago
        > By making absurd claims about the feasibility of the Pinephone as a daily driver Where did I make this claim? I said that I use it as a daily driver. It's possible, though not for everyone yet. > Also, is your goal to get people to use GNU/Linux phones or is it to maximize the overall adoption of Free Software? It's the same goal. Adoption of Free Software without using it on the phones will not help much. There are more people using smartphones than computers. I also don't see how one is a "radical shift" while the other is "gradual steps". It's the same to me. People are going to switch to new type of smartphones slowly: first developers, then early adopters, then theirs friends and then the rest. Same for Free Software. > HN audience is large and diverse enough to the point that it makes no sense to think as some homogeneous group of people who are interested in tinkering with their phones. This is true, but these people are "hackers", i.e. interested in though-provoking things and intellectually curious. I don't expect that they would just buy a new phone with a new OS without doing any research and believing a random comment on HN.

fsflover 5y ago

> If you are okay with not being able to reliably make calls, fine, but don't oversell on the definition of "daily driver" This is an outdated information. The development pace of Pinephone is unprecedented. Even here on HN I saw many recent posts saying that calls and MMS work fine already.

rglullis 5y ago
Ok, good to know. Too bad that I needed a phone 10 months ago. Update: reading through https://www.reddit.com/r/pinephone/comments/u6zzyc/how_pinephone_sucks_at_daily_use/ https://www.reddit.com/r/pinephone/comments/u6zzyc/how_pinep... (from 6 days ago) it seems like you are not just overselling hard, you are trying to convince people to switch to something that is absolutely not ready for general consumption. You do realize that if your goal is to get more people to adopt FOSS, your approach is more harmful than beneficial? Don't make promises that you can not keep, it will burn whatever goodwill people might have and it ends up convincing them Linux is never going to be for them.
- fsflover 5y ago
  Yes, it's not ready for general consumption. Mainly due to the battery life (I use two batteries) and sluggishness (it's fast if you use non-mainstream Sxmo). For Librem 5 (which I also preordered) both these points are fine (well, the battery is still worse than for Android). Note that we are not on Reddit but on HN. Is its audience ordinary people? My goal is to bring more technical people to GNU/Linux phones.
  - rglullis 5y ago
    HN audience is large and diverse enough to the point that it makes no sense to think as some homogeneous group of people who are interested in tinkering with their phones. By making absurd claims about the feasibility of the Pinephone as a daily driver, you are doing a disservice to your own community. Also, is your goal to get people to use GNU/Linux phones or is it to maximize the overall adoption of Free Software? The former requires a radical shift in consumer behavior and will be unlikely to happen, the latter can be done in gradual steps with a much higher chance of success. Think of it this way: if you manage to upset me, who is pretty much in favor of F/LOSS, imagine how many bridges you burned with those "on the other side"?
    - fsflover 5y ago
      > By making absurd claims about the feasibility of the Pinephone as a daily driver Where did I make this claim? I said that I use it as a daily driver. It's possible, though not for everyone yet. > Also, is your goal to get people to use GNU/Linux phones or is it to maximize the overall adoption of Free Software? It's the same goal. Adoption of Free Software without using it on the phones will not help much. There are more people using smartphones than computers. I also don't see how one is a "radical shift" while the other is "gradual steps". It's the same to me. People are going to switch to new type of smartphones slowly: first developers, then early adopters, then theirs friends and then the rest. Same for Free Software. > HN audience is large and diverse enough to the point that it makes no sense to think as some homogeneous group of people who are interested in tinkering with their phones. This is true, but these people are "hackers", i.e. interested in though-provoking things and intellectually curious. I don't expect that they would just buy a new phone with a new OS without doing any research and believing a random comment on HN.