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Another approach is to look at all the people you admire, and I mean ALL of them, and read up on the things they've done, and recognize that you either take the

Another approach is to look at all the people you admire, and I mean ALL of them, and read up on the things they've done, and recognize that you either take the good with the bad, or you end up alone. Musk was wrong about the "pedo guy" thing. There are also stories of him firing people for no reason, to satisfy his own petty emotional needs. None of this is okay. Einstein (and Ghandi, and MLK) cheated on their wives. Harvey Weinstien is a predator who produced Pulp Fiction. Ben Franklin (and Henry Ford) were virulent anti-semites. Von Neumann wanted to preemptively nuke Russia. Lincoln freed the slaves but was overtly racist. So go ahead and cut Musk out of your life for his behavior. But don't forget to cut out everyone else who's done what he's done, and worse. And cut out all those who don't agree with you, and certainly do not dirty yourself by the use of their discoveries. Do not watch, listen, or use what they've made, for these are the products of bad men, and by using their work you become bad, too.

davesque 5y ago
This is a great reply actually and does help to make me feel better. A lot of history's imperfections become lost in the distance. Although I should say that my list of idols is short for this very reason. I don't think I ever imagine that the real people behind historical figures were as perfect as we imagine. I think there's also an argument that we live in a time where a single person's failings have an outsized impact on the broader world because of how quickly their words travel. But the real impact of this is debatable. It's probably been said in every era that "this time is different."
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qwertygnu 5y ago
What's this about Ben Franklin being anti-Semitic? All the search results I see are articles dispelling that myth. e.g. https://www.jewishboston.com/read/how-benjamin-franklin-became-an-antisemite/ https://www.jewishboston.com/read/how-benjamin-franklin-beca...
- javajosh 5y ago
  From that same article: > on a few occasions he did use offensive language about Jews in his private correspondence, though this language does not come close to the antisemitic vitriol he ostensibly publicly uttered in the “Prophecy.” Franklin, who also owned slaves and featured slaves for sale in his newspaper prior to becoming an abolitionist, was not at all times free of prejudice. So if you have doubt about his antisemitism, have no doubt about his slave-holding. The next line in the article is quite good, too: >In much of today’s popular culture, there often seems to be room only for saints or villains. Franklin was neither. BTW I'm glad there's doubt about Franklin's anti-semitism. That one in particular always made me particularly sad, for some reason.
autophagian 5y ago
I think it's absolutely fair to ask whether Musk is the right person to improve discourse on Twitter given his behaviour on the topic in the past, and I don't think this has anything to do with not enjoying works made by flawed people. The latter is a much broader argument, the former is specifically on Musk's behaviour on a specific topic (whether you think he did shitty things on that topic or not).

davesque 5y ago

This is a great reply actually and does help to make me feel better. A lot of history's imperfections become lost in the distance. Although I should say that my list of idols is short for this very reason. I don't think I ever imagine that the real people behind historical figures were as perfect as we imagine. I think there's also an argument that we live in a time where a single person's failings have an outsized impact on the broader world because of how quickly their words travel. But the real impact of this is debatable. It's probably been said in every era that "this time is different."

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qwertygnu 5y ago

What's this about Ben Franklin being anti-Semitic? All the search results I see are articles dispelling that myth. e.g. https://www.jewishboston.com/read/how-benjamin-franklin-became-an-antisemite/ https://www.jewishboston.com/read/how-benjamin-franklin-beca...

javajosh 5y ago
From that same article: > on a few occasions he did use offensive language about Jews in his private correspondence, though this language does not come close to the antisemitic vitriol he ostensibly publicly uttered in the “Prophecy.” Franklin, who also owned slaves and featured slaves for sale in his newspaper prior to becoming an abolitionist, was not at all times free of prejudice. So if you have doubt about his antisemitism, have no doubt about his slave-holding. The next line in the article is quite good, too: >In much of today’s popular culture, there often seems to be room only for saints or villains. Franklin was neither. BTW I'm glad there's doubt about Franklin's anti-semitism. That one in particular always made me particularly sad, for some reason.

autophagian 5y ago

I think it's absolutely fair to ask whether Musk is the right person to improve discourse on Twitter given his behaviour on the topic in the past, and I don't think this has anything to do with not enjoying works made by flawed people. The latter is a much broader argument, the former is specifically on Musk's behaviour on a specific topic (whether you think he did shitty things on that topic or not).