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> do you think it would be better to just skip the project list? Hey, I'm not a specialist in this stuff - I've tended to stay in the same job until it became

> do you think it would be better to just skip the project list? Hey, I'm not a specialist in this stuff - I've tended to stay in the same job until it became impossible for some reason or other, so I haven't applied for that many jobs. But I was hitched to a careers consultant for 15 years, whose core trade was advising students on how to write résumés. Its only purpose is to get you an interview; if you drop your pants in the résumé, then there's nothing left for the recruiter to be curious about. A résumé is a concise overview of your education and career. If you feel you need to describe your objectives and attitudes, or expand on some major achievement, I think that belongs in your covering letter - which can be an essay of sorts (but I keep mine short). The covering letter is tailored to the firm you are applying to. The résumé can then be boilerplate, so you can use the same résumé for each firm you apply to; only the covering letter is customised. I treat the résumé as a sort of teaser. The covering letter has all the stuff about "If I can't get a job with your firm I'll have to kill myself, because no other employer will do" (no, please don't say anything like that!). But even the covering letter should not be more than two sides of paper. I'd stick to one side. If your concise pitch doesn't get you an interview, then doubling the length isn't going to improve your chances. Self-testimonials are a waste of space, if your recruiters are any good. For example, "I am a good team player" is worthless, unless you can provide evidence, such as "In my present position I mentor new recruits, and provide training courses for my colleagues". And I think that kind of stuff belongs in the covering letter. Again, I stress that I'm not a master of these matters. And most of my experience is based on UK hiring; I think puffing yourself up is more expected in the US tech marketplace. I've had one job in the USA, and I think I probably undersold myself that time.

em-bee 5y ago
well, the first page is more or less the cover letter. and i do adapt that depending on the job. hiding the list of projects for the sake of having material in the interview seems to contradict the idea that people want to see my projects on github. either they do want to see projects or they don't. the project descriptions aren't detailed, and definitely less than a github project. so there still is plenty to talk about. and i prefer interviews to be about things that can't easily be put in writing. spending the interview talking about historic facts feels like a waste of time. obviously as a candidate i can't choose what the interviewer wants to know, but by getting the facts out of the way, i feel like getting the freedom to talk about things that are actually interesting. worse, if i am asked to share something about an interesting project, i might not know what to talk about because i don't know what the interviewer wants to hear. but if they have the list of projects they can skim it, pick one they find interesting and ask about that. at least that is how my thinking goes. i haven't actually been interviewed for some time, being more on the opposite side of the table. as an interviewer i value these details because they allow me to find things to talk about. that is especially important with candidates who are not outspoken and may not be doing well answering open-ended questions. or they may just feel nervous, and not know what to say. the more i know about them up-front the easier it is for me to find something to talk about that they should be familiar with and ease them into the situation. i agree that a long prosaic CV where it is difficult to find the things that the hiring manager is looking for is not helpful, but a list of projects which is effectively a kind of portfolio as an appendix should not be that. maybe i should explicitly separate the project list from the CV, so that it doesn't look like the CV itself has 5 pages.

em-bee 5y ago

well, the first page is more or less the cover letter. and i do adapt that depending on the job. hiding the list of projects for the sake of having material in the interview seems to contradict the idea that people want to see my projects on github. either they do want to see projects or they don't. the project descriptions aren't detailed, and definitely less than a github project. so there still is plenty to talk about. and i prefer interviews to be about things that can't easily be put in writing. spending the interview talking about historic facts feels like a waste of time. obviously as a candidate i can't choose what the interviewer wants to know, but by getting the facts out of the way, i feel like getting the freedom to talk about things that are actually interesting. worse, if i am asked to share something about an interesting project, i might not know what to talk about because i don't know what the interviewer wants to hear. but if they have the list of projects they can skim it, pick one they find interesting and ask about that. at least that is how my thinking goes. i haven't actually been interviewed for some time, being more on the opposite side of the table. as an interviewer i value these details because they allow me to find things to talk about. that is especially important with candidates who are not outspoken and may not be doing well answering open-ended questions. or they may just feel nervous, and not know what to say. the more i know about them up-front the easier it is for me to find something to talk about that they should be familiar with and ease them into the situation. i agree that a long prosaic CV where it is difficult to find the things that the hiring manager is looking for is not helpful, but a list of projects which is effectively a kind of portfolio as an appendix should not be that. maybe i should explicitly separate the project list from the CV, so that it doesn't look like the CV itself has 5 pages.