5 ms·

What are you talking about? Just try and find a plumber, carpenter or contractor that isn’t backlogged for months. There’s a ton of really good blue collar jo

by influx 5y ago

What are you talking about? Just try and find a plumber, carpenter or contractor that isn’t backlogged for months. There’s a ton of really good blue collar jobs, often where you are your own boss. Unfortunately, society is pushing everyone to college.

giantg2 5y ago
This is really only true for certain locations. Also, to be your own boss means you have to understand how to obtain the licenses, start the business, etc. Many of the people who could do the actual job may not be able to the overhead to be their own boss. The companies do background checks and most don't really train. The overall percentage of these blue collar jobs are a much lower percentage than they used to be. So there's more competition. Good luck getting hired with even a minor criminal record or it you don't have a driver's license. I would quit my job today if I could make $100k
fartcannon 5y ago
It's possible that most people just dont want to be plumbers, right? Maybe they would like a chance to do something they think is more interesting. To suggest people just do the thing that makes them money highlights another problem if you ask me.
- lolinder 5y ago
  The question at hand is whether there are opportunities for people to make a living and support a family, not whether everyone can have a dream job. For the majority of humans throughout time, work has never been something that people do because they couldn't think of anything they'd rather be doing. It's always been a means to an end. Your comment suggests that it's not opportunities that have been lost in recent decades, it's that the younger generations' expectations for what life owes them have changed. That's not necessarily a bad thing, to a point. But it's not accurate to claim that the lack of dream jobs out there means that there are fewer opportunities for gainful employment than in generations prior.
- giantg2 5y ago
  I think I'd rather be a plumber or electrician than a dev. I'm so tired of all the BS at work. At least in those jobs you aren't sedentary and you actually get to see the positive impact you make on someone's life. Sure you might get some difficult customers occasionally, or be dealing with literal shit.
- s1artibartfast 5y ago
  The fact that people long for fun and interesting jobs that don't exist, is indeed a sperate problem. It does not negate the fact that there are high paying jobs available without college degrees.
- hackerfromthefu 5y ago
  I think this speaks to the heart of the matter, the expectations that people want. Yes it's beyond possible, it's clear that's the case, otherwise there wouldn't be a shortage of plumbers given they can make money to live or even raise a family on. But the sense of expectation has grown way beyond that, everyone wants to be an actor so they spend their time on tiktok, which is a winners market, and then the leftover masses that didn't build skills or work ethic complain about having to start at the bottom of the more 'realworld' pathways available. For most of human history people just did what made them money to live, and were glad if they have the chance to do just that. Go and spend six months in a third world country and you will see this is true.
- DeathArrow 4y ago
  So people should do only what they like and society is to fulfill anyone's wish and expectation? How would this be doable? Here's an alternative: everyone is responsible for himself, society is responsible only for the ill end disabled. Everyone is provided with a framework that enables him to learn, work and find himself a way to live and fulfill his wishes.
TheSpiceIsLife 5y ago
Sort of. Many trades here in Australia spent two decades employing apprentices in insufficient numbers, for whatever reasons, to meet projected requirements. Now we have insufficient tradespeople to meet demand, blowing out wait times to things like "not gonna happen this year mate" to repair a roof, and 7 months to fabricate new windows. The builders, roofers, and glaziers that do exist would prefer to work on green fields developments where they can do the same thing 50 times without moving their tools and equipment further than next door, so prices on minor repairs to existing houses have increased by a factor of "don't want the work, multiple the cost by five and quote at that" and that capacity is being eaten up by people borrowing $700,000 to fully renovate. It doesn't help that the building and fabrication trades have been run almost entirely by obnoxiously unbearable pricks, and when you spend twenty years telling everyone bullying isn't ok, is it any wonder young people don't want to do physically demanding work in terrible conditions working with obnoxiously unbearable pricks? When it's -10 degrees C outside, it's minus -10 in your work environment, when it's 40 plus degrees C it's 40 plus degrees in your work environment, and people rarely make big changes to themselves, so here we are.
- hackerfromthefu 5y ago
  You're right. At the same time the common alternatives of computer games and tiktok aren't going to build much of a future. Then for those that are motivated or smart there's plenty of other pathways in Australia today.

by influx 5y ago

giantg2 5y ago

This is really only true for certain locations. Also, to be your own boss means you have to understand how to obtain the licenses, start the business, etc. Many of the people who could do the actual job may not be able to the overhead to be their own boss. The companies do background checks and most don't really train. The overall percentage of these blue collar jobs are a much lower percentage than they used to be. So there's more competition. Good luck getting hired with even a minor criminal record or it you don't have a driver's license. I would quit my job today if I could make $100k

fartcannon 5y ago

It's possible that most people just dont want to be plumbers, right? Maybe they would like a chance to do something they think is more interesting. To suggest people just do the thing that makes them money highlights another problem if you ask me.

lolinder 5y ago
The question at hand is whether there are opportunities for people to make a living and support a family, not whether everyone can have a dream job. For the majority of humans throughout time, work has never been something that people do because they couldn't think of anything they'd rather be doing. It's always been a means to an end. Your comment suggests that it's not opportunities that have been lost in recent decades, it's that the younger generations' expectations for what life owes them have changed. That's not necessarily a bad thing, to a point. But it's not accurate to claim that the lack of dream jobs out there means that there are fewer opportunities for gainful employment than in generations prior.
giantg2 5y ago
I think I'd rather be a plumber or electrician than a dev. I'm so tired of all the BS at work. At least in those jobs you aren't sedentary and you actually get to see the positive impact you make on someone's life. Sure you might get some difficult customers occasionally, or be dealing with literal shit.
s1artibartfast 5y ago
The fact that people long for fun and interesting jobs that don't exist, is indeed a sperate problem. It does not negate the fact that there are high paying jobs available without college degrees.
hackerfromthefu 5y ago
I think this speaks to the heart of the matter, the expectations that people want. Yes it's beyond possible, it's clear that's the case, otherwise there wouldn't be a shortage of plumbers given they can make money to live or even raise a family on. But the sense of expectation has grown way beyond that, everyone wants to be an actor so they spend their time on tiktok, which is a winners market, and then the leftover masses that didn't build skills or work ethic complain about having to start at the bottom of the more 'realworld' pathways available. For most of human history people just did what made them money to live, and were glad if they have the chance to do just that. Go and spend six months in a third world country and you will see this is true.
DeathArrow 4y ago
So people should do only what they like and society is to fulfill anyone's wish and expectation? How would this be doable? Here's an alternative: everyone is responsible for himself, society is responsible only for the ill end disabled. Everyone is provided with a framework that enables him to learn, work and find himself a way to live and fulfill his wishes.

TheSpiceIsLife 5y ago

Sort of. Many trades here in Australia spent two decades employing apprentices in insufficient numbers, for whatever reasons, to meet projected requirements. Now we have insufficient tradespeople to meet demand, blowing out wait times to things like "not gonna happen this year mate" to repair a roof, and 7 months to fabricate new windows. The builders, roofers, and glaziers that do exist would prefer to work on green fields developments where they can do the same thing 50 times without moving their tools and equipment further than next door, so prices on minor repairs to existing houses have increased by a factor of "don't want the work, multiple the cost by five and quote at that" and that capacity is being eaten up by people borrowing $700,000 to fully renovate. It doesn't help that the building and fabrication trades have been run almost entirely by obnoxiously unbearable pricks, and when you spend twenty years telling everyone bullying isn't ok, is it any wonder young people don't want to do physically demanding work in terrible conditions working with obnoxiously unbearable pricks? When it's -10 degrees C outside, it's minus -10 in your work environment, when it's 40 plus degrees C it's 40 plus degrees in your work environment, and people rarely make big changes to themselves, so here we are.

hackerfromthefu 5y ago
You're right. At the same time the common alternatives of computer games and tiktok aren't going to build much of a future. Then for those that are motivated or smart there's plenty of other pathways in Australia today.