4 ms·

This! Most of the flaming identity cultural wars are basically a distraction. The problem as always is class, and elites vieing for control. Yes progressive va

by mola 5y ago

This! Most of the flaming identity cultural wars are basically a distraction. The problem as always is class, and elites vieing for control. Yes progressive values are a thing, but its media representation is nuts, on purpose. The it's us vs them narrative leads to subjucating all values to pure "survival". This promotes long term irrationality. The powers at be know this and capitalize it. On both "sides". In my biased opinion this sort of Machiavellism is more common with conservatives, but its definitely common enough in non conservatives.

dudul 5y ago
Why do you think it's more common with conservatives? You said it yourself, cultural wars are just distraction to keep the elite in power and talk about everything except classes. People in power don't care about conservatives or liberals, they just pick a team and play the game.
- hotpotamus 5y ago
  Which party has been dedicated to cutting the taxes of the wealthy for decades? As the saying goes, show me your budget and I'll show you your values.
  - fallingknife 5y ago
    Which party is dedicated to importing massive numbers of cheap workers from other countries to allow business owners to undercut working class wages and pocket more profits?
    - hotpotamus 5y ago
      Umm... The one that uses immigrants as scapegoats for votes and then does nothing to effectively regulate the businesses that import cheap workers? Take for instance the Trump family - https://www.npr.org/2017/01/12/509179558/trump-winery-is-seeking-visas-for-foreign-workers https://www.npr.org/2017/01/12/509179558/trump-winery-is-see...
    - skinnymuch 5y ago
      What about all the rich or powerful conservatives who end up having cheap workers brought here to work at their homes and so on?
    - quintushoratius 5y ago
      I suspect that you're implying that the answer is the US Democratic party, but it's really not. By making immigration-without-visas a criminal offense, rather than an administrative one, the anti-immigration movement serves to drive immigrants (but not immigration) underground and makes their labor cheaper. It's a lot like prostitution: since prostitution is a criminal offense, all prostitutes are criminals. They can be abused freely because they cannot go to the authorities without certainty being punished themselves. By the same token, an undocumented immigrant cannot contact authorities to report they're underpaid, stolen from, beaten, imprisoned, or enslaved. (These are all things that happen regularly.) Their "criminal" status is used as a cudgel to abuse them. Keep in mind, these are all people that just want to work in exchange for money, and they're responding to people and companies that want to hire their services. The "illegal immigration" posturing is just the buyers' way of artificially depressing prices.
- PartiallyTyped 5y ago
  Because their base consists of people who: - are severely uneducated. Consider distribution of political alignments in Academia. Consider the fact that antivaxxers and conspiracy theorists are in their overwhelming majority politically conservative and authoritarian. Belief in conspiracy theories is highly correlated with an impoverished interpersonal functioning, such as interpersonal paranoia, narcissism, disagreeableness, insecure attachment and Machiavellianism [1]. Impoverished interpersonal skills signify lack of empathy, which fuels dehumanization, and enables exploitation of others. - grew up hammered by propaganda and the red scare, where anything that resembles social welfare is considered communism even if they themselves are dependent on such systems. Accepting that one needs help is exceptionally difficult for a person high on narcissism and paranoia. Furthermore, when threatened, the brain takes "conservative" stances, i.e. stances that preserve the status quo. When faced with an ever changing world that does not resemble anything that they were accustomed to, they cling on to the closest sense of status quo even if the person or structure that supports it only does so for optics. The lack of education makes it difficult for them to see that they are played like pawns by the bourgeoisie, that they receive preferential treatment through systemic issues [2], and finally they misattribute the reasons for their successes due to their obliviousness [3]. [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6282974/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6282974/ [2] https://libcom.org/library/advance-class-struggle-abolish-white-race https://libcom.org/library/advance-class-struggle-abolish-wh... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attribution_(psychology) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attribution_(psychology) Kind reminder that I stated facts, so please argue, as adults :) .

by mola 5y ago

dudul 5y ago

Why do you think it's more common with conservatives? You said it yourself, cultural wars are just distraction to keep the elite in power and talk about everything except classes. People in power don't care about conservatives or liberals, they just pick a team and play the game.

hotpotamus 5y ago
Which party has been dedicated to cutting the taxes of the wealthy for decades? As the saying goes, show me your budget and I'll show you your values.
- fallingknife 5y ago
  Which party is dedicated to importing massive numbers of cheap workers from other countries to allow business owners to undercut working class wages and pocket more profits?
  - hotpotamus 5y ago
    Umm... The one that uses immigrants as scapegoats for votes and then does nothing to effectively regulate the businesses that import cheap workers? Take for instance the Trump family - https://www.npr.org/2017/01/12/509179558/trump-winery-is-seeking-visas-for-foreign-workers https://www.npr.org/2017/01/12/509179558/trump-winery-is-see...
  - skinnymuch 5y ago
    What about all the rich or powerful conservatives who end up having cheap workers brought here to work at their homes and so on?
  - quintushoratius 5y ago
    I suspect that you're implying that the answer is the US Democratic party, but it's really not. By making immigration-without-visas a criminal offense, rather than an administrative one, the anti-immigration movement serves to drive immigrants (but not immigration) underground and makes their labor cheaper. It's a lot like prostitution: since prostitution is a criminal offense, all prostitutes are criminals. They can be abused freely because they cannot go to the authorities without certainty being punished themselves. By the same token, an undocumented immigrant cannot contact authorities to report they're underpaid, stolen from, beaten, imprisoned, or enslaved. (These are all things that happen regularly.) Their "criminal" status is used as a cudgel to abuse them. Keep in mind, these are all people that just want to work in exchange for money, and they're responding to people and companies that want to hire their services. The "illegal immigration" posturing is just the buyers' way of artificially depressing prices.
PartiallyTyped 5y ago
Because their base consists of people who: - are severely uneducated. Consider distribution of political alignments in Academia. Consider the fact that antivaxxers and conspiracy theorists are in their overwhelming majority politically conservative and authoritarian. Belief in conspiracy theories is highly correlated with an impoverished interpersonal functioning, such as interpersonal paranoia, narcissism, disagreeableness, insecure attachment and Machiavellianism [1]. Impoverished interpersonal skills signify lack of empathy, which fuels dehumanization, and enables exploitation of others. - grew up hammered by propaganda and the red scare, where anything that resembles social welfare is considered communism even if they themselves are dependent on such systems. Accepting that one needs help is exceptionally difficult for a person high on narcissism and paranoia. Furthermore, when threatened, the brain takes "conservative" stances, i.e. stances that preserve the status quo. When faced with an ever changing world that does not resemble anything that they were accustomed to, they cling on to the closest sense of status quo even if the person or structure that supports it only does so for optics. The lack of education makes it difficult for them to see that they are played like pawns by the bourgeoisie, that they receive preferential treatment through systemic issues [2], and finally they misattribute the reasons for their successes due to their obliviousness [3]. [1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6282974/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6282974/ [2] https://libcom.org/library/advance-class-struggle-abolish-white-race https://libcom.org/library/advance-class-struggle-abolish-wh... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attribution_(psychology) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attribution_(psychology) Kind reminder that I stated facts, so please argue, as adults :) .