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Why does the cables trace the Iberian and French coastlines rather than a taking a more direct route?

by Y-bar 5y ago

hetspookjee 5y ago
I'm guessing it has to do with the EU, but it seems far more sensical if it went straight through and allow others to give/receive as well.
- nerdawson 5y ago
  That would make it dependent on the countries it hopped through and subject to their political whims. The Gibraltar issue crops up every now and then for instance so having control over an electrical connection gives the Spanish government more leverage. Same with France and the dispute over fishing waters. Only recently France were threatening to cut off power to Jersey.
  - seszett 5y ago
    > Only recently France were threatening to cut off power to Jersey. Just want to add that it was a bit different than that. More exactly, an English newspaper asked a French official if cutting electricity off was a possibility and that official answered nothing more than "the treaty that was agreed upon does include this as a possibility". It was never an actual threat or in any plan at the time.
    - mike_hearn 5y ago
      That's not quite correct: [Europe Minister] Clément Beaune, who is a close ally of the French president, Emmanuel Macron, said action would be decided on within days and discussions were already in motion .... [Beaune] added, "We defend our interests. We do it nicely, and diplomatically, but when that doesn’t work we take measures. The Channel Islands, the UK, are dependent on us for their energy supply. They think they can live on their own and badmouth Europe as well. And because it doesn’t work, they indulge in one-upmanship, and in an aggressive way" https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/05/france-uk-jersey-eu-energy-supply-fishing-row-channel https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/05/france-uk-jers... "Reducing supplies (of electricity to Jersey) is possible, but cutting the power to every Jersey resident this winter is something that will not happen and something that I do not want," Europe Minister Clement Beaune told BFM-TV in an interview. https://www.dailysabah.com/world/europe/france-could-reduce-jersey-electricity-supplies-in-uk-fishing-row https://www.dailysabah.com/world/europe/france-could-reduce-... France could cut electricity supply to UK Channel Island Jersey unless a post-Brexit fishing agreement is respected, Maritime Minister Annick Girardin told the French parliament May 4. https://www.spglobal.com/commodityinsights/en/market-insights/latest-news/oil/050521-france-threatens-to-cut-electricity-supply-to-jersey-in-fishing-row https://www.spglobal.com/commodityinsights/en/market-insight... French fishermen are struggling to obtain fishing licenses allowing them to keep working in U.K. waters, including in Jersey. They must show they have been fishing in these waters from 2012 to 2016 using GPS data, which some don't have. "As you know, the [Brexit] agreement contains retaliatory measures ... So as far as Jersey is concerned, I would remind you, for example, of the transport of electricity via submarine cables. So we have the means, and even though I'm sorry it has come to this, we will do so if we have to," she told the French parliament. https://www.politico.eu/article/fishing-brexit-eu-uk-jersey/ https://www.politico.eu/article/fishing-brexit-eu-uk-jersey/
  - WastingMyTime89 5y ago
    There is a very easy way for the UK to solve the Gibraltar issue. The same line of reasoning would also allow it to drastically improve its relationship with Argentina.
    - argsnd 5y ago
      Yeah just hand over any territory anyone ever makes a weak claim to just to avoid conflict despite the wishes of the people who live there. Has your "Z" bumper sticker arrived in the mail yet?
      - WastingMyTime89 5y ago
        Let’s conveniently forget that Gibraltar is actually territorially part of Spain, most essential facilities are provided by Spain, that a significant proportion of jobs necessary to it are held by Spaniard and that Gibraltar economy is due to it being a tax haven which would stop if it was part of Spain. Oversee territories are a shame on every countries that still hold them be it the UK or France.
        blibble 5y ago
        > Let’s conveniently forget that Gibraltar is actually territorially part of Spain it is most definitely not it handed it over in the peace treaty that ended the war > The Catholic King does hereby, for himself, his heirs and successors, yield to the Crown of Great Britain the full and entire propriety of the town and castle of Gibraltar, together with the port, fortifications, and forts thereunto belonging; and he gives up the said propriety to be held and enjoyed absolutely with all manner of right for ever, without any exception or impediment whatsoever. full text here: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Peace_and_Friendship_Treaty_of_Utrecht_between_Spain_and_Great_Britain https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Peace_and_Friendship_Treaty_o... > Oversee territories are a shame on every countries that still hold them be it the UK or France. meanwhile Spain has two enclaves of the exact same type of in Morocco, Ceuta and Melilla
        5y ago
_dain_ 5y ago
shallower water
- Y-bar 5y ago
  I am not knowledgeable in high voltage transmission, but in which ways does the shallower water depth affect the transmission line?
  - tremon 5y ago
    It doesn't; it affects the cost of laying it. The cable must be anchored to the sea floor at regular intervals and it's cheaper to place an anchor at a few hundred meters depth (the coastal shelves) than at 3 km (depth of the Biscay abyssal plain).
    - lazide 5y ago
      It wouldn’t surprise me either if it helps in some legal situations - if someone runs over your cable in Spanish territorial waters vs international waters for instance, it’s probably easier to get paid back.

Why does the cables trace the Iberian and French coastlines rather than a taking a more direct route?

by Y-bar 5y ago

Why does the cables trace the Iberian and French coastlines rather than a taking a more direct route?

I'm guessing it has to do with the EU, but it seems far more sensical if it went straight through and allow others to give/receive as well.

nerdawson 5y ago
That would make it dependent on the countries it hopped through and subject to their political whims. The Gibraltar issue crops up every now and then for instance so having control over an electrical connection gives the Spanish government more leverage. Same with France and the dispute over fishing waters. Only recently France were threatening to cut off power to Jersey.
- seszett 5y ago
  > Only recently France were threatening to cut off power to Jersey. Just want to add that it was a bit different than that. More exactly, an English newspaper asked a French official if cutting electricity off was a possibility and that official answered nothing more than "the treaty that was agreed upon does include this as a possibility". It was never an actual threat or in any plan at the time.
  - mike_hearn 5y ago
    That's not quite correct: [Europe Minister] Clément Beaune, who is a close ally of the French president, Emmanuel Macron, said action would be decided on within days and discussions were already in motion .... [Beaune] added, "We defend our interests. We do it nicely, and diplomatically, but when that doesn’t work we take measures. The Channel Islands, the UK, are dependent on us for their energy supply. They think they can live on their own and badmouth Europe as well. And because it doesn’t work, they indulge in one-upmanship, and in an aggressive way" https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/05/france-uk-jersey-eu-energy-supply-fishing-row-channel https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/05/france-uk-jers... "Reducing supplies (of electricity to Jersey) is possible, but cutting the power to every Jersey resident this winter is something that will not happen and something that I do not want," Europe Minister Clement Beaune told BFM-TV in an interview. https://www.dailysabah.com/world/europe/france-could-reduce-jersey-electricity-supplies-in-uk-fishing-row https://www.dailysabah.com/world/europe/france-could-reduce-... France could cut electricity supply to UK Channel Island Jersey unless a post-Brexit fishing agreement is respected, Maritime Minister Annick Girardin told the French parliament May 4. https://www.spglobal.com/commodityinsights/en/market-insights/latest-news/oil/050521-france-threatens-to-cut-electricity-supply-to-jersey-in-fishing-row https://www.spglobal.com/commodityinsights/en/market-insight... French fishermen are struggling to obtain fishing licenses allowing them to keep working in U.K. waters, including in Jersey. They must show they have been fishing in these waters from 2012 to 2016 using GPS data, which some don't have. "As you know, the [Brexit] agreement contains retaliatory measures ... So as far as Jersey is concerned, I would remind you, for example, of the transport of electricity via submarine cables. So we have the means, and even though I'm sorry it has come to this, we will do so if we have to," she told the French parliament. https://www.politico.eu/article/fishing-brexit-eu-uk-jersey/ https://www.politico.eu/article/fishing-brexit-eu-uk-jersey/
- WastingMyTime89 5y ago
  There is a very easy way for the UK to solve the Gibraltar issue. The same line of reasoning would also allow it to drastically improve its relationship with Argentina.
  - argsnd 5y ago
    Yeah just hand over any territory anyone ever makes a weak claim to just to avoid conflict despite the wishes of the people who live there. Has your "Z" bumper sticker arrived in the mail yet?
    - WastingMyTime89 5y ago
      Let’s conveniently forget that Gibraltar is actually territorially part of Spain, most essential facilities are provided by Spain, that a significant proportion of jobs necessary to it are held by Spaniard and that Gibraltar economy is due to it being a tax haven which would stop if it was part of Spain. Oversee territories are a shame on every countries that still hold them be it the UK or France.
      - blibble 5y ago
        > Let’s conveniently forget that Gibraltar is actually territorially part of Spain it is most definitely not it handed it over in the peace treaty that ended the war > The Catholic King does hereby, for himself, his heirs and successors, yield to the Crown of Great Britain the full and entire propriety of the town and castle of Gibraltar, together with the port, fortifications, and forts thereunto belonging; and he gives up the said propriety to be held and enjoyed absolutely with all manner of right for ever, without any exception or impediment whatsoever. full text here: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Peace_and_Friendship_Treaty_of_Utrecht_between_Spain_and_Great_Britain https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Peace_and_Friendship_Treaty_o... > Oversee territories are a shame on every countries that still hold them be it the UK or France. meanwhile Spain has two enclaves of the exact same type of in Morocco, Ceuta and Melilla
        5y ago

_dain_ 5y ago

shallower water

Y-bar 5y ago
I am not knowledgeable in high voltage transmission, but in which ways does the shallower water depth affect the transmission line?
- tremon 5y ago
  It doesn't; it affects the cost of laying it. The cable must be anchored to the sea floor at regular intervals and it's cheaper to place an anchor at a few hundred meters depth (the coastal shelves) than at 3 km (depth of the Biscay abyssal plain).
  - lazide 5y ago
    It wouldn’t surprise me either if it helps in some legal situations - if someone runs over your cable in Spanish territorial waters vs international waters for instance, it’s probably easier to get paid back.