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I am at the moment working with a guy whose job is to digitalise old (usually amateur) movies filmed on 8mm and 16mm reels. It's a bit of a shame to see these

by pluies 15y ago

I am at the moment working with a guy whose job is to digitalise old (usually amateur) movies filmed on 8mm and 16mm reels. It's a bit of a shame to see these go, because the quality of 50-yo footage is quite incredible, even without any post-processing. The sheer simplicity and sturdiness of some old mechanical Russian camera is also amazing. What will happen of the videos we are shooting now? I'm pretty sure we'll be losing a lot more of it to hard drive failures or simple mistakes. Digital is a lot harder to store away in the attic to be re-discovered by your grandchildren.

Klinky 15y ago
People have lost troves of footage & pictures due to fire & water damage thanks to physical formats. People will also lose footage & pictures to digital media loss/damage, though it's much easier to duplicate a hard drive or a couple thousand data files than it is to duplicate a physical format. While it may be sad that the grandkids aren't going to find 8mm film in the attic, there's nothing really stipulating that even if they did find it they'd have the ambitiousness to track down the proper equipment to view the footage. It's not like you can walk into most any store & find an 8mm or 16mm player. If the fear is that people won't be able to play the content a previous generation created, that fear has already been realized with 8mm & 16mm film.
- codedivine 15y ago
  On the other hand, I am hoping people won't be storing content in proprietary formats without a spec, or heaven-forbid with some DRM restrictions, or you might not have the proper software (or the proper rights if DRMed) to play it back 50 years later.
  - InclinedPlane 15y ago
    In the realm of master copies for films the issue isn't so much DRM as merely encryption. There's likely to be some pressure to ensure that the master is "secure" from "thievery" regardless of where the bits physically reside, which will probably manifest itself in the use of strong encryption. Which, of course, brings up the question of what happens when the files are still around but the encryption keys are lost. The bigger problem is the classic fundamental problem of data retention. The people responsible for retention probably do not value the retention of the data independent of other developments to be of sufficient value to guarantee that retention with robust measures. For example, they could leave unencrypted copies (or encrypted copies with the encryption keys separate) in the custody of the library of congress. Or they could use some sort of N of M keys encryption system and distribute copies and keys to numerous individuals or institutions around the world. Etc. However, while such things would retention of the media would be valuable to the world at large even after, say, a global catastrophe (asteroid impact, nuclear war, etc.) or merely the bankruptcy of the company that created the media such concerns the company itself would tend not to share those ideals.
    - Klinky 15y ago
      This is more of a management issue than anything to do with the format your information is stored in. Lots of physical reels of film, photographs & documents have been lost due to poor management & I am sure this trend will continue into the digital age.
bradleyland 15y ago
The biggest advantage of digital formats is that they're easily duplicated in many locations. Making 5 copies of a digital video and distributing to friends means that there are five exactly equal-quality copies of the film in circulation. Doing the same with film formats is far more difficult.
- InclinedPlane 15y ago
  Another enormous advantage is that every copy can be exactly as good as the original. With film it was always necessary to go to great lengths to preserve the master copy, because all other copies were lower quality.
  - dsr_ 15y ago
    Related enormous advantage at the theater: no scratches, no dings, no reel-change markers... and the quality is exactly the same on the five hundredth showing as on the first. Oh, and changing from 2 screens of last week's unexpected hit premiere to six is as simple as a call to the distributor. Speaking of which, expect distribution as a business to disappear. There's no reason not to do business directly from production house to theater chain if you never have to ship anything bigger than a FedEx'd hard disk, or an authentication license for download.
    - InclinedPlane 15y ago
      More so: the cost of copying and transporting an HD (70mm equivalent) print to a theatre is a tiny fraction of what it is for film. Which enables greater flexibility, as you point out, but also enables more money to go to the theatre or to the artists.

by pluies 15y ago

Klinky 15y ago

People have lost troves of footage & pictures due to fire & water damage thanks to physical formats. People will also lose footage & pictures to digital media loss/damage, though it's much easier to duplicate a hard drive or a couple thousand data files than it is to duplicate a physical format. While it may be sad that the grandkids aren't going to find 8mm film in the attic, there's nothing really stipulating that even if they did find it they'd have the ambitiousness to track down the proper equipment to view the footage. It's not like you can walk into most any store & find an 8mm or 16mm player. If the fear is that people won't be able to play the content a previous generation created, that fear has already been realized with 8mm & 16mm film.

codedivine 15y ago
On the other hand, I am hoping people won't be storing content in proprietary formats without a spec, or heaven-forbid with some DRM restrictions, or you might not have the proper software (or the proper rights if DRMed) to play it back 50 years later.
- InclinedPlane 15y ago
  In the realm of master copies for films the issue isn't so much DRM as merely encryption. There's likely to be some pressure to ensure that the master is "secure" from "thievery" regardless of where the bits physically reside, which will probably manifest itself in the use of strong encryption. Which, of course, brings up the question of what happens when the files are still around but the encryption keys are lost. The bigger problem is the classic fundamental problem of data retention. The people responsible for retention probably do not value the retention of the data independent of other developments to be of sufficient value to guarantee that retention with robust measures. For example, they could leave unencrypted copies (or encrypted copies with the encryption keys separate) in the custody of the library of congress. Or they could use some sort of N of M keys encryption system and distribute copies and keys to numerous individuals or institutions around the world. Etc. However, while such things would retention of the media would be valuable to the world at large even after, say, a global catastrophe (asteroid impact, nuclear war, etc.) or merely the bankruptcy of the company that created the media such concerns the company itself would tend not to share those ideals.
  - Klinky 15y ago
    This is more of a management issue than anything to do with the format your information is stored in. Lots of physical reels of film, photographs & documents have been lost due to poor management & I am sure this trend will continue into the digital age.

bradleyland 15y ago

The biggest advantage of digital formats is that they're easily duplicated in many locations. Making 5 copies of a digital video and distributing to friends means that there are five exactly equal-quality copies of the film in circulation. Doing the same with film formats is far more difficult.

InclinedPlane 15y ago
Another enormous advantage is that every copy can be exactly as good as the original. With film it was always necessary to go to great lengths to preserve the master copy, because all other copies were lower quality.
- dsr_ 15y ago
  Related enormous advantage at the theater: no scratches, no dings, no reel-change markers... and the quality is exactly the same on the five hundredth showing as on the first. Oh, and changing from 2 screens of last week's unexpected hit premiere to six is as simple as a call to the distributor. Speaking of which, expect distribution as a business to disappear. There's no reason not to do business directly from production house to theater chain if you never have to ship anything bigger than a FedEx'd hard disk, or an authentication license for download.
  - InclinedPlane 15y ago
    More so: the cost of copying and transporting an HD (70mm equivalent) print to a theatre is a tiny fraction of what it is for film. Which enables greater flexibility, as you point out, but also enables more money to go to the theatre or to the artists.