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Consider the Android distros that are free from Google services. I am on /e/OS which has an android base. Between its app store and F-Droid, you get almost ever

Consider the Android distros that are free from Google services. I am on /e/OS which has an android base. Between its app store and F-Droid, you get almost everything you'd want from a mobile OS (minus games) without all the Google/Apple/Samsung crap.

fsflover 5y ago
> you get almost everything you'd want from a mobile OS (minus games) You forgot reasonable support time: Proprietary drivers prevent you from upgrading the Linux kernel, and the device becomes very insecure and outdated within few years.
- rglullis 5y ago
  No, I did not. I am running the Fairphone, which is guaranteed to be updated for 7 years.
  - fsflover 5y ago
    My Pinephone and (soon) Librem 5 are guaranteed to have support for the lifetime.
    - rglullis 5y ago
      Is there any practical difference between 7 years and "lifetime" or you just want to get into a "let's see who supports FOSS more" measuring contest?
      - fsflover 5y ago
        My 12+-year-old laptop is fully functioning with Debian now. It serves well till today and I don't see any reason to through it away.
        rglullis 5y ago
        Let me put this in another way: you already purchased a pinephone and a librem in the span of a few years. You already blew up your e-waste quota for the next 10-15 years, and you don't even have a device that could be considered a daily driver. Meanwhile I have a phone that is based on free software (for all the aspects where it matters) and that works. Today. And which has future potential to be just as free as the librem/pinephone - after all, if the code being developed by Purism is free, it can be adopted by other vendors. A laptop from 12 years ago more likely than not has less memory than a mid-range phone from today, and unless such laptop is your only device for all this time, it has no point in this conversation.
        fsflover 5y ago
        > and you don't even have a device that could be considered a daily driver I do use it as a daily driver. > unless such laptop is your only device for all this time, it has no point in this conversation It's the only device used by my non-technical relative. But even if it wasn't, the device would serve a purpose and not be another piece of e-waste. > And which has future potential to be just as free You can't upgrade Linux on your phone due to the proprietary drivers. You're stuck with the ancient version. When it's not supported, your device effectively becomes a brick, unless you are going to recompile everything yourself or fine with being hacked.
        rglullis 5y ago
        Even the most hardcore linux enthusiasts that tried the pinephone claim that they can not reliably make calls, have constant crashes and the app ecosystem is limited. If you are okay with not being able to reliably make calls, fine, but don't oversell on the definition of "daily driver". > You can't upgrade Linux on your phone due to the proprietary drivers. Hardware-specific binary blobs don't stop the UBPorts devs to make constant updates to my old BenQ phone. The software part is still up-to-date, but the application catalog is almost non-existent, the hardware is limited (1GB RAM) and the camera is shit. Eventually I want to turn that device into a networked music player, but as a smartphone it didn't last two years. If I manage to get 7 years out of this Fairphone, its ROI will have been unbelievably great, I will gladly buy whatever comes from Fairphone in 2027, and I will try to find another use for this device. Hopefully by then Linux on mobile will have matured, but I don't need to compromise on my actual needs just to please the FOSS-purists.
    - kaba0 5y ago
      Notify me when their lifetime actually start. Because other than playing with them, they are currently not up to the definition of a daily driver-ready mobile device.

fsflover 5y ago

> you get almost everything you'd want from a mobile OS (minus games) You forgot reasonable support time: Proprietary drivers prevent you from upgrading the Linux kernel, and the device becomes very insecure and outdated within few years.

rglullis 5y ago
No, I did not. I am running the Fairphone, which is guaranteed to be updated for 7 years.
- fsflover 5y ago
  My Pinephone and (soon) Librem 5 are guaranteed to have support for the lifetime.
  - rglullis 5y ago
    Is there any practical difference between 7 years and "lifetime" or you just want to get into a "let's see who supports FOSS more" measuring contest?
    - fsflover 5y ago
      My 12+-year-old laptop is fully functioning with Debian now. It serves well till today and I don't see any reason to through it away.
      - rglullis 5y ago
        Let me put this in another way: you already purchased a pinephone and a librem in the span of a few years. You already blew up your e-waste quota for the next 10-15 years, and you don't even have a device that could be considered a daily driver. Meanwhile I have a phone that is based on free software (for all the aspects where it matters) and that works. Today. And which has future potential to be just as free as the librem/pinephone - after all, if the code being developed by Purism is free, it can be adopted by other vendors. A laptop from 12 years ago more likely than not has less memory than a mid-range phone from today, and unless such laptop is your only device for all this time, it has no point in this conversation.
        fsflover 5y ago
        > and you don't even have a device that could be considered a daily driver I do use it as a daily driver. > unless such laptop is your only device for all this time, it has no point in this conversation It's the only device used by my non-technical relative. But even if it wasn't, the device would serve a purpose and not be another piece of e-waste. > And which has future potential to be just as free You can't upgrade Linux on your phone due to the proprietary drivers. You're stuck with the ancient version. When it's not supported, your device effectively becomes a brick, unless you are going to recompile everything yourself or fine with being hacked.
        rglullis 5y ago
        Even the most hardcore linux enthusiasts that tried the pinephone claim that they can not reliably make calls, have constant crashes and the app ecosystem is limited. If you are okay with not being able to reliably make calls, fine, but don't oversell on the definition of "daily driver". > You can't upgrade Linux on your phone due to the proprietary drivers. Hardware-specific binary blobs don't stop the UBPorts devs to make constant updates to my old BenQ phone. The software part is still up-to-date, but the application catalog is almost non-existent, the hardware is limited (1GB RAM) and the camera is shit. Eventually I want to turn that device into a networked music player, but as a smartphone it didn't last two years. If I manage to get 7 years out of this Fairphone, its ROI will have been unbelievably great, I will gladly buy whatever comes from Fairphone in 2027, and I will try to find another use for this device. Hopefully by then Linux on mobile will have matured, but I don't need to compromise on my actual needs just to please the FOSS-purists.
  - kaba0 5y ago
    Notify me when their lifetime actually start. Because other than playing with them, they are currently not up to the definition of a daily driver-ready mobile device.