4 ms·

Aphants - I'm wondering how much you enjoy reading fiction? Seems like a visual imagination would help you enjoy it a bit more. I have seen a youtuber describe

by mjfl 5y ago

Aphants - I'm wondering how much you enjoy reading fiction? Seems like a visual imagination would help you enjoy it a bit more. I have seen a youtuber describe her aphantasia and how she doesn't enjoy reading, perhaps for this reason.

khazhoux 5y ago
I finally realized that I probably experience fiction at a much shittier quality than other people, and have basically given up on it. I mean, most fiction is lame IMHO anyway, but I get nothing out of visual descriptions. The characters play out their scenes basically in voids, or in the barest of sets (a room, a house, the bottom of a mountain).
- kaashif 5y ago
  I always found the most engaging fiction to be the ones that explore really interesting concepts, rather than ones that try to describe rather mundane things happening. I told someone I absolutely loved Asimov's Foundation series and they had a really weird complaint - they said it was just people sitting in rooms talking. Maybe occasionally they'd smoke a cigar. I said yeah, but they're talking about something really cool! Would those books have really been improved if Asimov described the smoke or the room or whatever? Like who cares? I don't even have aphantasia, but man, sometimes there's a really long description of something in a book and I can barely get through it.
  - cartoonfoxes 5y ago
    I've read lots of sci-fi, but never Foundation. Knowing how well-regarded it is among fans of the genre, hearing it described as "people sitting in rooms talking" is the best hook I've heard in a while.
    - kaashif 5y ago
      Researching it now, I think Asimov actually had aphantasia, he talks about how he can't visualise at all: > IA: "I have no talent whatsoever for writing movie scripts." > Interviewer:"How can this be." > IA: "Easy. The requirements are different." > Interviewer: "Writing character or..." > IA: "Well you have to have a picture in your mind. You can't just tell a story. You have to at all times know what's on the screen." > Interviewer: "Visual medium." > IA: "And it's useless to ask me to do that. I never see anything that I write, I only hear it. Conversations, all that I'm aware of. That's why my books are so "talky". One of the reviews of Nemesis says it's talky (oh what do they know) but it's true. It's great talk but he wouldn't know that." > Interviewer: "But what you talk about is visualizable." > IA: "I suppose, but that's purely accidental." From this Reddit comment: https://www.reddit.com/r/Aphantasia/comments/euvz05/apparently_andrej_sapkowski_author_of_the_witcher/ffu1t1p/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Aphantasia/comments/euvz05/apparent... although the video linked appears to be dead.
saberdancer 5y ago
I enjoy reading a lot. However I do not really have complicated imagery in my mind when I do. Since learning of aphantasia I've had several moments when I am at the edge of falling asleep where I can see clear visual images. I do not have control over the images and they usually relate to something that happened during the day. It's fascinating to see as I usually can't visualize almost anything - the way I would describe it is that I can "talk" about what I see in my mind, kind of like I have a text-based game in my mind and when I am visualizing, I am describing what I want to see, not what I am seeing. There are no details that I notice without consciously bringing in.
jiggawatts 5y ago
I have read literally thousands of science fiction and fantasy books. Something I enjoy is watching the film or TV show versions of a book I had read before — I get to enjoy the same story twice in two different ways. I’ve heard many people complain about such adaptations because it didn’t match what they were visualising while reading the novel. For me this is not a problem so I get more enjoyment out of adaptations. Even while reading, for me the joy is not about picturing any specific image or scene. It’s about the feeling of immersion in a world. I love stories where I can a idea of what living in that context would feel like. This is an abstract notion without any specific visualisation. Not everyone can do this, and I think they’re missing out. I can “step into” the shoes of someone and look at the world through their eyes, see their perspective, and feel what they feel. My partner can’t, for example. She just stares blankly at the news about the war in Ukraine. It means nothing to her past the visuals. Burnt out cars, damaged buildings, etc… I instead “see” the terror, the sleepless nights, the unmaking of everything you have built and the destruction of your children’s future. I imagine hiding in a dark tunnel clutching a heavy gun cold from the winter air, listening to your own breathing — too loud — and hoping you’ll hear the Russians’ footsteps before they hear you. But there’s too many of them, and there’s just you and this antique weapon defending you neighbours.
snorremd 5y ago
I can find some enjoyment in books that do not overly rely on visual imagery. I quite enjoyed the Martian because it focused so much on the character’s thoughts and the state of the character’s mind. I enjoyed the first three the Expanse books because of the political world building and character development. Though watching the TV adaptation added a new layer to the story as it could fill out the visual gaps, so to speak, of my reading experience. But I find myself being drawn in to movies and TV shows as they can render entirely new visual worlds that are unlike anything I can experience on my own. I guess this is also why I don’t mind movie and TV adaptations so much.
wallacoloo 5y ago
i'm sure perception is cool when reading, but arguably it's cool mostly because the imagery leads you to _feel_ certain ways? when an author describes a moonlit scene with the protagonist alone at the edge of a lake watching the patterns of ripples on the water... that instills some meaningful emotion in me. perhaps a feeling of solitude, or that of a calm evening where i feel in-touch with the world. so... to what extent does limited imagery decrease the emotional potency of a scene? a few people have told me "yes, i still feel something when i read that scene. it's more that i can't imagine any of the character's faces". i haven't met anyone who says they feel literally no emotions when reading any scene, but that doesn't mean they don't exist, nor does it mean the emotional response isn't attenuated.
srcreigh 5y ago
Not much for exactly this reason. Some fiction is more poetic and dialogue-y or emotional so it's fine. I loved Zen and the art of motorcycle maintenance. I never understood the descriptions of environment or anything. I'm just reading the words aloud to myself in my head and not seeing it so it's kinda a waste.
wccrawford 5y ago
I'm probably aphastasic. Like others here, I struggle to picture things in my mind, and they are very sketchy even then. I love reading fiction, but I realized a long time ago that I consume books differently than other people. People around me would describe people in scenes in the book as if they'd seen them, and I've never experienced that. I consume the facts, but I don't visualize them. I also often can't remember if I read a book or watched a movie when someone asks about something. To me, afterwards, they're largely the same thing. I remember what happened, but video or text makes no real difference. And finally... I think I've got a fair helping of face blindness. I sometimes can't recognize people if they change some major part of themselves, like hairstyle/color or grow a beard. I remember at work, walking by someone's desk and asking myself, 'Who is sitting at X's desk?' Then like 10 steps later, I realized that X is sitting at her desk, she just had a wildly different hair style. That wasn't my first instance of it, but it's a fairly vivid one. And for fun: When I remember that scene, the outline of the cubical is pretty clear, but what X looked like then is completely missing and so is all of the stuff in her cubicle. I remember what direction I was walking, but I get no visuals of the actual walk. I know she had things like a calendar and a computer, but I don't picture them at all. When I think about that calendar, I see the outline of it approximately where it was in relation to the cubical's outline, but that's it.
orinatic 5y ago
I have aphantasia. I love reading fiction, but books that rely on extensive visual imagery tend to fall flat for me (most recently The Night Circus, but there have been others).
fortysixdegrees 5y ago
The only fiction I get any pleasure from is comedy.
sdefresne 5y ago
I enjoy reading a lots, but I prefer dialogs over long descriptions. I don't visualize how the characters / places can looks from descriptions. Unless the writing is really clear, I may struggle if the layout of the scene is important (say a crime scene with a description of the room, its exits, ...). I sometimes skip description of the characters physique because I know that I won't remember it a few page later, and it usually do not matter in the story anyway (and if it matters, it is usually reminded to the reader because aphantasia is not the only reason a reader may not remember how a character is dressed or looks like).
- scruple 5y ago
  I also prefer heavy dialogue in my reading. Books that are primarily world building an be a struggle. I read a lot, averaging about 40 pages a day, every day, but I also indiscriminately put books down and move on, so it helps to keep me engaged in the habit. I have to maintain a large backlog, though, but it's never been an issue. edit/ I'm also entertaining the idea of getting into graphic novels and seeing how I respond to them.
hemreldop 5y ago

by mjfl 5y ago

khazhoux 5y ago

I finally realized that I probably experience fiction at a much shittier quality than other people, and have basically given up on it. I mean, most fiction is lame IMHO anyway, but I get nothing out of visual descriptions. The characters play out their scenes basically in voids, or in the barest of sets (a room, a house, the bottom of a mountain).

kaashif 5y ago
I always found the most engaging fiction to be the ones that explore really interesting concepts, rather than ones that try to describe rather mundane things happening. I told someone I absolutely loved Asimov's Foundation series and they had a really weird complaint - they said it was just people sitting in rooms talking. Maybe occasionally they'd smoke a cigar. I said yeah, but they're talking about something really cool! Would those books have really been improved if Asimov described the smoke or the room or whatever? Like who cares? I don't even have aphantasia, but man, sometimes there's a really long description of something in a book and I can barely get through it.
- cartoonfoxes 5y ago
  I've read lots of sci-fi, but never Foundation. Knowing how well-regarded it is among fans of the genre, hearing it described as "people sitting in rooms talking" is the best hook I've heard in a while.
  - kaashif 5y ago
    Researching it now, I think Asimov actually had aphantasia, he talks about how he can't visualise at all: > IA: "I have no talent whatsoever for writing movie scripts." > Interviewer:"How can this be." > IA: "Easy. The requirements are different." > Interviewer: "Writing character or..." > IA: "Well you have to have a picture in your mind. You can't just tell a story. You have to at all times know what's on the screen." > Interviewer: "Visual medium." > IA: "And it's useless to ask me to do that. I never see anything that I write, I only hear it. Conversations, all that I'm aware of. That's why my books are so "talky". One of the reviews of Nemesis says it's talky (oh what do they know) but it's true. It's great talk but he wouldn't know that." > Interviewer: "But what you talk about is visualizable." > IA: "I suppose, but that's purely accidental." From this Reddit comment: https://www.reddit.com/r/Aphantasia/comments/euvz05/apparently_andrej_sapkowski_author_of_the_witcher/ffu1t1p/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Aphantasia/comments/euvz05/apparent... although the video linked appears to be dead.

saberdancer 5y ago

I enjoy reading a lot. However I do not really have complicated imagery in my mind when I do. Since learning of aphantasia I've had several moments when I am at the edge of falling asleep where I can see clear visual images. I do not have control over the images and they usually relate to something that happened during the day. It's fascinating to see as I usually can't visualize almost anything - the way I would describe it is that I can "talk" about what I see in my mind, kind of like I have a text-based game in my mind and when I am visualizing, I am describing what I want to see, not what I am seeing. There are no details that I notice without consciously bringing in.

jiggawatts 5y ago

I have read literally thousands of science fiction and fantasy books. Something I enjoy is watching the film or TV show versions of a book I had read before — I get to enjoy the same story twice in two different ways. I’ve heard many people complain about such adaptations because it didn’t match what they were visualising while reading the novel. For me this is not a problem so I get more enjoyment out of adaptations. Even while reading, for me the joy is not about picturing any specific image or scene. It’s about the feeling of immersion in a world. I love stories where I can a idea of what living in that context would feel like. This is an abstract notion without any specific visualisation. Not everyone can do this, and I think they’re missing out. I can “step into” the shoes of someone and look at the world through their eyes, see their perspective, and feel what they feel. My partner can’t, for example. She just stares blankly at the news about the war in Ukraine. It means nothing to her past the visuals. Burnt out cars, damaged buildings, etc… I instead “see” the terror, the sleepless nights, the unmaking of everything you have built and the destruction of your children’s future. I imagine hiding in a dark tunnel clutching a heavy gun cold from the winter air, listening to your own breathing — too loud — and hoping you’ll hear the Russians’ footsteps before they hear you. But there’s too many of them, and there’s just you and this antique weapon defending you neighbours.

snorremd 5y ago

I can find some enjoyment in books that do not overly rely on visual imagery. I quite enjoyed the Martian because it focused so much on the character’s thoughts and the state of the character’s mind. I enjoyed the first three the Expanse books because of the political world building and character development. Though watching the TV adaptation added a new layer to the story as it could fill out the visual gaps, so to speak, of my reading experience. But I find myself being drawn in to movies and TV shows as they can render entirely new visual worlds that are unlike anything I can experience on my own. I guess this is also why I don’t mind movie and TV adaptations so much.

wallacoloo 5y ago

i'm sure perception is cool when reading, but arguably it's cool mostly because the imagery leads you to _feel_ certain ways? when an author describes a moonlit scene with the protagonist alone at the edge of a lake watching the patterns of ripples on the water... that instills some meaningful emotion in me. perhaps a feeling of solitude, or that of a calm evening where i feel in-touch with the world. so... to what extent does limited imagery decrease the emotional potency of a scene? a few people have told me "yes, i still feel something when i read that scene. it's more that i can't imagine any of the character's faces". i haven't met anyone who says they feel literally no emotions when reading any scene, but that doesn't mean they don't exist, nor does it mean the emotional response isn't attenuated.

srcreigh 5y ago

Not much for exactly this reason. Some fiction is more poetic and dialogue-y or emotional so it's fine. I loved Zen and the art of motorcycle maintenance. I never understood the descriptions of environment or anything. I'm just reading the words aloud to myself in my head and not seeing it so it's kinda a waste.

wccrawford 5y ago

I'm probably aphastasic. Like others here, I struggle to picture things in my mind, and they are very sketchy even then. I love reading fiction, but I realized a long time ago that I consume books differently than other people. People around me would describe people in scenes in the book as if they'd seen them, and I've never experienced that. I consume the facts, but I don't visualize them. I also often can't remember if I read a book or watched a movie when someone asks about something. To me, afterwards, they're largely the same thing. I remember what happened, but video or text makes no real difference. And finally... I think I've got a fair helping of face blindness. I sometimes can't recognize people if they change some major part of themselves, like hairstyle/color or grow a beard. I remember at work, walking by someone's desk and asking myself, 'Who is sitting at X's desk?' Then like 10 steps later, I realized that X is sitting at her desk, she just had a wildly different hair style. That wasn't my first instance of it, but it's a fairly vivid one. And for fun: When I remember that scene, the outline of the cubical is pretty clear, but what X looked like then is completely missing and so is all of the stuff in her cubicle. I remember what direction I was walking, but I get no visuals of the actual walk. I know she had things like a calendar and a computer, but I don't picture them at all. When I think about that calendar, I see the outline of it approximately where it was in relation to the cubical's outline, but that's it.

orinatic 5y ago

I have aphantasia. I love reading fiction, but books that rely on extensive visual imagery tend to fall flat for me (most recently The Night Circus, but there have been others).

fortysixdegrees 5y ago

The only fiction I get any pleasure from is comedy.

sdefresne 5y ago

I enjoy reading a lots, but I prefer dialogs over long descriptions. I don't visualize how the characters / places can looks from descriptions. Unless the writing is really clear, I may struggle if the layout of the scene is important (say a crime scene with a description of the room, its exits, ...). I sometimes skip description of the characters physique because I know that I won't remember it a few page later, and it usually do not matter in the story anyway (and if it matters, it is usually reminded to the reader because aphantasia is not the only reason a reader may not remember how a character is dressed or looks like).

scruple 5y ago
I also prefer heavy dialogue in my reading. Books that are primarily world building an be a struggle. I read a lot, averaging about 40 pages a day, every day, but I also indiscriminately put books down and move on, so it helps to keep me engaged in the habit. I have to maintain a large backlog, though, but it's never been an issue. edit/ I'm also entertaining the idea of getting into graphic novels and seeing how I respond to them.

hemreldop 5y ago