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I found the intro on multiple personality disorder and tiktok interesting, but the article is really about politics, which isn’t reflected in the title. I lost

I found the intro on multiple personality disorder and tiktok interesting, but the article is really about politics, which isn’t reflected in the title. I lost interest when he mentioned leftists

tantalor 4y ago
It's mentioned in the subtitle: > TikTok culture can be incredibly toxic, but those on the left refuse to ever condemn it for fear of echoing conservatives
meowface 4y ago
Fair reaction, but just as an FYI, Freddie deBoer is himself a prominent leftist blogger. So this is kind of an "intra-leftism" dispute. That arguably makes it a little less eye-rolling to read as one might find from a rightist critiquing the left, or vice versa.
- PaulDavisThe1st 4y ago
  There's a lot of gatekeeping over what counts a "genuine left-ism" and deBoer is probably one the people most subject to it over the last decade. He is routinely eviscerated for his views on many other clearly left-ish blogs etc. and generally not treated respectfully in such venues. Don't even consider bringing up his name or any of his writing on, for example, Lawyers Gun Money, unless you do not mind being ridiculed too. So yeah, intra-leftism dispute is probably more applicable to deBoer than almost any other old-school-but-still-at-it blogged that I can think of.
rob_c 4y ago
Trying to replay a-politically (with the knowledge that nothing happens in a political vacuum in reality). It can be successfully argued that the political left have adopted the drama and status of victimhood in a way that hasn't been done before in mainstream politics and given the strong correlation between political affiliation and age I think it's a concerning edge to the topic of mental health, or perception there of. The right is also capitalising very late on this claiming that marxist censorship by private entities is akin to victimisation so the whole arena is now filled with it :( Not saying you're wrong for tuning out the article certainly is a little rambly.
- naravara 4y ago
  > It can be successfully argued that the political left have adopted the drama and status of victimhood in a way that hasn't been done before in mainstream politics It absolutely has. The martyr/persecution complex is a central elements of dominionist Christian politics.
  - rob_c 4y ago
    I'm fairly sure most of the 'dominionist' christian politics was based on expansionist bigotry, i.e. "lets go beat god into the heathens" and "cold is gods way of telling us we need to burn more protestants". The modern victimhood isn't based on hiding in attacks, priest holes or being afraid to show your face in public, it's being a screaming matyr to some slight, imagined or not, and demanding the same level of attention for everything from nasty words to really injustice against fellow humans. Again, I'm not saying either situation is correct, why we can't move past this childish way of viewing the world saddens me, but there is a difference between true oppression and standing up in-front of a crowd and claiming to be oppressed. Yes I am actually using text-book definition of literal oppression here and not some imagined slight of someone against a large group of people who think differently. The latter is akin to me feeling oppressed because I can't find or import the right cheeses/food that I grew up with where I live due to market forces and economics, the former is being told I can't do it because of some prejudice or law. There is and always will be an important difference here.
    - FooBarBizBazz 4y ago
      > "cold is gods way of telling us we need to burn more protestants". What? Christian Dominianists typically are Protestants, last I checked. (Yes, American Catholics do contain a faction that's been shifting right, and there's a whole Wikipedia article about "Integralism", but this is not the kind of thing you usually find from them...) But yeah, there are strains of Christianity that really like the "Romans fed us to the lions" stories. As far as I can tell, most tribes do this in one way or another. Not all, but a good fraction. That they defend those stories to the end, and that their opponents try to deny that same victimhood status, I think speaks volumes. Everybody wants to be owed.
Elof 4y ago
Closing with people on the other side aren't going to agree with me makes me think this person likes stirring the pot and getting attention, which is one of the things called out as dangerous in their argument. FWIW, I think lots of people self diagnose for attention and I absolutely agree that mental health shouldn't be something we laud (we should normalize it though) even though the author would almost definitely group me with the leftists.
- meowface 4y ago
  The author is himself a prominent leftist blogger, so this is kind of an "intra-leftism" dispute.

I found the intro on multiple personality disorder and tiktok interesting, but the article is really about politics, which isn’t reflected in the title. I lost interest when he mentioned leftists

tantalor 4y ago

It's mentioned in the subtitle: > TikTok culture can be incredibly toxic, but those on the left refuse to ever condemn it for fear of echoing conservatives

meowface 4y ago

Fair reaction, but just as an FYI, Freddie deBoer is himself a prominent leftist blogger. So this is kind of an "intra-leftism" dispute. That arguably makes it a little less eye-rolling to read as one might find from a rightist critiquing the left, or vice versa.

PaulDavisThe1st 4y ago
There's a lot of gatekeeping over what counts a "genuine left-ism" and deBoer is probably one the people most subject to it over the last decade. He is routinely eviscerated for his views on many other clearly left-ish blogs etc. and generally not treated respectfully in such venues. Don't even consider bringing up his name or any of his writing on, for example, Lawyers Gun Money, unless you do not mind being ridiculed too. So yeah, intra-leftism dispute is probably more applicable to deBoer than almost any other old-school-but-still-at-it blogged that I can think of.

rob_c 4y ago

Trying to replay a-politically (with the knowledge that nothing happens in a political vacuum in reality). It can be successfully argued that the political left have adopted the drama and status of victimhood in a way that hasn't been done before in mainstream politics and given the strong correlation between political affiliation and age I think it's a concerning edge to the topic of mental health, or perception there of. The right is also capitalising very late on this claiming that marxist censorship by private entities is akin to victimisation so the whole arena is now filled with it :( Not saying you're wrong for tuning out the article certainly is a little rambly.

naravara 4y ago
> It can be successfully argued that the political left have adopted the drama and status of victimhood in a way that hasn't been done before in mainstream politics It absolutely has. The martyr/persecution complex is a central elements of dominionist Christian politics.
- rob_c 4y ago
  I'm fairly sure most of the 'dominionist' christian politics was based on expansionist bigotry, i.e. "lets go beat god into the heathens" and "cold is gods way of telling us we need to burn more protestants". The modern victimhood isn't based on hiding in attacks, priest holes or being afraid to show your face in public, it's being a screaming matyr to some slight, imagined or not, and demanding the same level of attention for everything from nasty words to really injustice against fellow humans. Again, I'm not saying either situation is correct, why we can't move past this childish way of viewing the world saddens me, but there is a difference between true oppression and standing up in-front of a crowd and claiming to be oppressed. Yes I am actually using text-book definition of literal oppression here and not some imagined slight of someone against a large group of people who think differently. The latter is akin to me feeling oppressed because I can't find or import the right cheeses/food that I grew up with where I live due to market forces and economics, the former is being told I can't do it because of some prejudice or law. There is and always will be an important difference here.
  - FooBarBizBazz 4y ago
    > "cold is gods way of telling us we need to burn more protestants". What? Christian Dominianists typically are Protestants, last I checked. (Yes, American Catholics do contain a faction that's been shifting right, and there's a whole Wikipedia article about "Integralism", but this is not the kind of thing you usually find from them...) But yeah, there are strains of Christianity that really like the "Romans fed us to the lions" stories. As far as I can tell, most tribes do this in one way or another. Not all, but a good fraction. That they defend those stories to the end, and that their opponents try to deny that same victimhood status, I think speaks volumes. Everybody wants to be owed.

Elof 4y ago

Closing with people on the other side aren't going to agree with me makes me think this person likes stirring the pot and getting attention, which is one of the things called out as dangerous in their argument. FWIW, I think lots of people self diagnose for attention and I absolutely agree that mental health shouldn't be something we laud (we should normalize it though) even though the author would almost definitely group me with the leftists.

meowface 4y ago
The author is himself a prominent leftist blogger, so this is kind of an "intra-leftism" dispute.