4 ms·

I've read (need to dig up the source again) that high infrastructure costs in the US are in part due to the same problem. The government doesn't even have exper

I've read (need to dig up the source again) that high infrastructure costs in the US are in part due to the same problem. The government doesn't even have experts anymore who could write the request to take offers on. Maybe in some cases a slightly larger government can be a leaner government.

ragebol 5y ago
I think the issue with a lot of governments is: expertise and competence is expensive. If you don't want to pay for that because the government is then expensive, fine, but eventually you'll have an incompetent government that is slow and still expensive due to the mishaps it leads to, for itself and it's constituents.
- soco 5y ago
  So option 1 is expensive and gets stuff done, and option 2 is expensive and shitty. And we have to go the way of option 2 because...
  - null0ranje 5y ago
    Congress, mostly.
  - ragebol 5y ago
    Well, option 2 is cheaper at first. Then everything breaks down eventually and that is costly, but later. Kind of like technical debt, but for a whole government. Also, there will be hell from the public when the govt. makes a mistake. So, there's all sorts of bureaucracy, checklists etc, to keep that from happening or to at least have people accountable. Which also slows stuff down.
- namelessoracle 5y ago
  The idea that the federal government cant hire "competent engineers" is kind of odd to me. Federal government can pay enough to get software engineers. FAANG salaries are an outlier. They could easily target some midwestern state, put the headquarters for federal software agency there, find a feeder school, and get employees fed to an agency making a comfortable 6 figures in a low cost of living area. Will there be some attrition? Sure. But plenty will stay cause thats where family is, and where they have their house, and thats where there kids go to school and etc. I can guarantee you that the contractors they hire from Accenture and IBM are using devs that arent making FAANG salaries. Its kind of a meme how bad some of the government contractors are, its pretty well known you can just be a body that sits at a desk if you can get a security clearance and make easy money just manually running an SQL script once a week on some of these government contracts. The real reason nothing gets fixed is because the federal workers get free salaries and benefits packages that far outstrip their value that oversee these projects, and the contracting firms get easy money.
  - mywittyname 5y ago
    > They could easily target some midwestern state, put the headquarters for federal software agency there, find a feeder school, and get employees fed to an agency making a comfortable 6 figures in a low cost of living area. They have this already: midwestern schools which have affiliations to the military and act as feeder schools for technical people into the military industrial complex. These people still make more than the GS schedule cap by mid career with TS clearance. It surely doesn't pay faang salaries, but $150-200k with 25% bonus/profit sharing, and totally paid family health care, and <asks someone> 320 hours of pto. Plus, these places often have nice company events, like corporate retreats to nice locales (including family), etc.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
Symmetry 5y ago
When Alon Levy was comparing transit construction costs in various places around the world they found that having in house experts was one of the biggest causes of low costs. Though see also this critique[1] of Boeing's massive outsourcing and compare to SpaceX. [1]https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.documentcloud.org/documents/69746/hart-smith-on-outsourcing.pdf https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.documentcloud.org/documents/6974...
formerkrogemp 5y ago
Raise taxes, close loopholes, fund and modernize the IRS, incentivize R&D and entrepreneurship, increase government spending and expertise, improve government auditing, cut defense spending graft, refill positions left vacant during the 2016-2020 state department staffing fiasco, fund childcare, expand Pre-K schooling, subsidize critical infrastructure build out, and nationalize some right of way land for infrastructure to start with. Sounds easy.
- pc86 5y ago
  It's like the people commenting here have never been through even a single election cycle.
  - formerkrogemp 5y ago
    Nah, it's just wishful thinking. I've knocked on doors, done the calling campaigns, ran the emails and texts. I don't think it'll happen, and I don't try so much anymore. I just vote nowadays.

ragebol 5y ago

I think the issue with a lot of governments is: expertise and competence is expensive. If you don't want to pay for that because the government is then expensive, fine, but eventually you'll have an incompetent government that is slow and still expensive due to the mishaps it leads to, for itself and it's constituents.

soco 5y ago
So option 1 is expensive and gets stuff done, and option 2 is expensive and shitty. And we have to go the way of option 2 because...
- null0ranje 5y ago
  Congress, mostly.
- ragebol 5y ago
  Well, option 2 is cheaper at first. Then everything breaks down eventually and that is costly, but later. Kind of like technical debt, but for a whole government. Also, there will be hell from the public when the govt. makes a mistake. So, there's all sorts of bureaucracy, checklists etc, to keep that from happening or to at least have people accountable. Which also slows stuff down.
namelessoracle 5y ago
The idea that the federal government cant hire "competent engineers" is kind of odd to me. Federal government can pay enough to get software engineers. FAANG salaries are an outlier. They could easily target some midwestern state, put the headquarters for federal software agency there, find a feeder school, and get employees fed to an agency making a comfortable 6 figures in a low cost of living area. Will there be some attrition? Sure. But plenty will stay cause thats where family is, and where they have their house, and thats where there kids go to school and etc. I can guarantee you that the contractors they hire from Accenture and IBM are using devs that arent making FAANG salaries. Its kind of a meme how bad some of the government contractors are, its pretty well known you can just be a body that sits at a desk if you can get a security clearance and make easy money just manually running an SQL script once a week on some of these government contracts. The real reason nothing gets fixed is because the federal workers get free salaries and benefits packages that far outstrip their value that oversee these projects, and the contracting firms get easy money.
- mywittyname 5y ago
  > They could easily target some midwestern state, put the headquarters for federal software agency there, find a feeder school, and get employees fed to an agency making a comfortable 6 figures in a low cost of living area. They have this already: midwestern schools which have affiliations to the military and act as feeder schools for technical people into the military industrial complex. These people still make more than the GS schedule cap by mid career with TS clearance. It surely doesn't pay faang salaries, but $150-200k with 25% bonus/profit sharing, and totally paid family health care, and <asks someone> 320 hours of pto. Plus, these places often have nice company events, like corporate retreats to nice locales (including family), etc.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]

Symmetry 5y ago

When Alon Levy was comparing transit construction costs in various places around the world they found that having in house experts was one of the biggest causes of low costs. Though see also this critique[1] of Boeing's massive outsourcing and compare to SpaceX. [1]https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.documentcloud.org/documents/69746/hart-smith-on-outsourcing.pdf https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.documentcloud.org/documents/6974...

formerkrogemp 5y ago

Raise taxes, close loopholes, fund and modernize the IRS, incentivize R&D and entrepreneurship, increase government spending and expertise, improve government auditing, cut defense spending graft, refill positions left vacant during the 2016-2020 state department staffing fiasco, fund childcare, expand Pre-K schooling, subsidize critical infrastructure build out, and nationalize some right of way land for infrastructure to start with. Sounds easy.

pc86 5y ago
It's like the people commenting here have never been through even a single election cycle.
- formerkrogemp 5y ago
  Nah, it's just wishful thinking. I've knocked on doors, done the calling campaigns, ran the emails and texts. I don't think it'll happen, and I don't try so much anymore. I just vote nowadays.