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> And I really still don't understand any use case for someone in a first world country to use crypto. Hi. Here is a use case you can carry on to future discus

> And I really still don't understand any use case for someone in a first world country to use crypto. Hi. Here is a use case you can carry on to future discussions. There is a flourishing scene of dark net markets where people can purchase drugs using cryptocurrency. Merchants have reviews, products have reviews, and the whole process is much safer, secure, and convenient than meeting a drug dealer in real life with cash.

DebtDeflation 4y ago
Except (at least in the case of BTC) that transaction will be permanently recorded on an indelible blockchain for everyone to see. Such security and privacy.
- reedjosh 4y ago
  Bitcoin Lighting Network and Monero ftw. Bitcoin is not yet perfect. Hopefully someday. Monero however is pretty great privacy wise.
  - rvz 4y ago
    > Bitcoin Lighting Network and Monero ftw. Two things: 1. Bitcoin Lightning is not Bitcoin and is in fact a centralized by design layer 2 system which the transactions are off-chain [0][1], a direct contradiction to what Bitcoin was designed for. A peer-to-peer on-chain electronic cash system. 2. Monero and the other privacy coins are getting delisted and banned from exchanges due to increasing regulations. [2][3][4] You can still use Monero, but the on-ramps, exchanges will have banned the privacy coins under these regulations, cutting a way to easily exchange it for fiat. [0] https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1367-2630/aba062 https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1367-2630/aba062 [1] https://arxiv.org/pdf/2201.07746.pdf https://arxiv.org/pdf/2201.07746.pdf [2] https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/currencies/monero-kraken-crypto-exchange-delist-privacy-coin-uk-fca-regulation-2021-11 https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/currencies/monero-k... [3] https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2021/12/01/anti-money-laundering-council-agrees-its-negotiating-mandate-on-transparency-of-crypto-asset-transfers/ https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2021... [4] https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2022/03/31/eu-parliament-votes-on-privacy-busting-crypto-rules-industry-rails-against-proposals/ https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2022/03/31/eu-parliament-vot...
    - cconroy 4y ago
      satoshi's use of cash probably referred to the concept of final settlement.
    - reedjosh 4y ago
      > 1. Bitcoin Lightning is not Bitcoin and is in fact a centralized by design layer 2 system Yes, but I personally have node equipment sitting in my closet waiting to be setup. (time constraints) It's not so centralized that it's obviously destined to be controlled by Governments and Corporations. I would put proof of stake down as being much more controllable by monied interest. > 2. Monero and the other privacy coins are getting delisted and banned from exchanges due to increasing regulations. That's sad, but it leads me to two thoughts. One, I'm glad I don't live in the UK or EU, and I think it's gross that something like that happens without the input of the people. Not that I'd put it entirely past the US to do this either (sigh). Two, hopefully Uniswap and other decentralized exchanges will allow for people to swap into privacy coins without a regulated exchange, but I agree there are probably numerous ways to penalize or track the entrance and exit thereof. I think really this comes down to getting off exchanges asap and trying to actually use the currency. My local community has a group that actively uses the currencies for exchange, but who knows how strongly that would survive if the currencies couldn't off ramp to fiat.
MrMan 4y ago
legalization works even better and doesn't destroy society with drug wars and cartel violence
HWR_14 4y ago
If your goal is to ensure crypto isn't cracked down on by governments, finding legal uses would be valuable. Clearly crypto is valuable to break the law. After all, look at the number of crypto scams. Or ransomware attacks.

DebtDeflation 4y ago

Except (at least in the case of BTC) that transaction will be permanently recorded on an indelible blockchain for everyone to see. Such security and privacy.

reedjosh 4y ago
Bitcoin Lighting Network and Monero ftw. Bitcoin is not yet perfect. Hopefully someday. Monero however is pretty great privacy wise.
- rvz 4y ago
  > Bitcoin Lighting Network and Monero ftw. Two things: 1. Bitcoin Lightning is not Bitcoin and is in fact a centralized by design layer 2 system which the transactions are off-chain [0][1], a direct contradiction to what Bitcoin was designed for. A peer-to-peer on-chain electronic cash system. 2. Monero and the other privacy coins are getting delisted and banned from exchanges due to increasing regulations. [2][3][4] You can still use Monero, but the on-ramps, exchanges will have banned the privacy coins under these regulations, cutting a way to easily exchange it for fiat. [0] https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1367-2630/aba062 https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1367-2630/aba062 [1] https://arxiv.org/pdf/2201.07746.pdf https://arxiv.org/pdf/2201.07746.pdf [2] https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/currencies/monero-kraken-crypto-exchange-delist-privacy-coin-uk-fca-regulation-2021-11 https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/currencies/monero-k... [3] https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2021/12/01/anti-money-laundering-council-agrees-its-negotiating-mandate-on-transparency-of-crypto-asset-transfers/ https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2021... [4] https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2022/03/31/eu-parliament-votes-on-privacy-busting-crypto-rules-industry-rails-against-proposals/ https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2022/03/31/eu-parliament-vot...
  - cconroy 4y ago
    satoshi's use of cash probably referred to the concept of final settlement.
  - reedjosh 4y ago
    > 1. Bitcoin Lightning is not Bitcoin and is in fact a centralized by design layer 2 system Yes, but I personally have node equipment sitting in my closet waiting to be setup. (time constraints) It's not so centralized that it's obviously destined to be controlled by Governments and Corporations. I would put proof of stake down as being much more controllable by monied interest. > 2. Monero and the other privacy coins are getting delisted and banned from exchanges due to increasing regulations. That's sad, but it leads me to two thoughts. One, I'm glad I don't live in the UK or EU, and I think it's gross that something like that happens without the input of the people. Not that I'd put it entirely past the US to do this either (sigh). Two, hopefully Uniswap and other decentralized exchanges will allow for people to swap into privacy coins without a regulated exchange, but I agree there are probably numerous ways to penalize or track the entrance and exit thereof. I think really this comes down to getting off exchanges asap and trying to actually use the currency. My local community has a group that actively uses the currencies for exchange, but who knows how strongly that would survive if the currencies couldn't off ramp to fiat.

MrMan 4y ago

legalization works even better and doesn't destroy society with drug wars and cartel violence

HWR_14 4y ago

If your goal is to ensure crypto isn't cracked down on by governments, finding legal uses would be valuable. Clearly crypto is valuable to break the law. After all, look at the number of crypto scams. Or ransomware attacks.