5 ms·

Not to mention that he's compromising on accuracy. Yeah, 1 second is tiny, but why give it up if you don't have to? Especially those of you reading who want to

by adgar 15y ago

Not to mention that he's compromising on accuracy. Yeah, 1 second is tiny, but why give it up if you don't have to? Especially those of you reading who want to try this on a potentially more dynamic site. Edit: downvoted with no explanation, cute. And readers here think they're above Reddit standards. There's no reason to compromise the integrity of a system to any extent before you have to. As others have demonstrated, that need was clearly not met here.

maratd 15y ago
> Not to mention that he's compromising on accuracy. Yeah, 1 second is tiny, but why give it up if you don't have to? While NGINX may use very little CPU and have minimal hard drive access, PHP (or Java/Python/Ruby/etc.) will hit those resources hard. Look, I'm not one of those environmentalist wackos who pisses his pants when somebody forgets to turn off a light ... but ... if you're keeping your BLOG server a hundred times busier than it has to be just so that your users don't experience a staleness of 1 second ... you're an asshole. A military or medical application, fine. But a blog? Sorry, no.
- scott_s 15y ago
  you're an asshole. Not necessary.
  - adgar 15y ago
    > Not necessary. He might have a point if 100x is even close to a realistic increase... again, as demonstrated by other posts in this thread, this isn't the case.
    - gruseom 15y ago
      It's not about whether he has a point, it's about calling others assholes. In face-to-face conversation there are lots of ways to do that without being strident; in writing it's too heavy-handed. Scrupulously avoiding such aggressiveness is one of the few easy things we can do to prop up the discourse.
  - deleted 15y ago
    [deleted]
gruseom 15y ago
downvoted with no explanation, cute. And readers here think they're above Reddit standards. Downvoting with no explanation is arguably acceptable here. There's disagreement about it, but people do it all the time, including me when I don't have time to type in a comment or feel like doing so would add more noise than signal (like, probably, right now). Complaining about being downvoted, though, definitely is not.
- adgar 15y ago
  How can explaining why you downvoted, when nobody else has, add more noise than signal, unless your opinion is not worth sharing in the first place? And if your opinion is not worth sharing, why is it worth a downvote? Let's be honest - we downvote here because we disagree, just like very other site.
  - deleted 15y ago
    [deleted]
  - gruseom 15y ago
    That's a good enough question that you've provoked me into figuring out what I think about this. Adding words takes up space. A downvote doesn't. Therefore a downvote is more lightweight, therefore there are times when it's more appropriate than a comment. It's an in-between gesture, partway between silence and verbalization. I like that subtlety. It's an especially good way to express disagreement with something one feels is not only wrong but also somehow debasing. A comment doesn't have to be rude to be debasing, it can just be mediocre or somehow crass, nor is one always able to say exactly how. Those are cases where fostering more discussion is unlikely to do good and it's better to hold one's tongue. But downvoting still gives a signal to the original commenter as well as to other readers that someone's not ok with what was said. I think that's meaningful, and also that it's fairly rare to see people abusing that signal. It does happen, but more often when someone thinks they don't deserve it, it's kind of obvious to others that really they do. So when it happens, the best way to respond is with a touch of self-honesty. Maybe you'll come out roses but just maybe you'll notice something worth correcting. One other thing about downvoting. I think what makes it controversial, and also interesting, is that it's an emotional expression. (Upvotes are too, but downvotes are stronger.) That explains why people get upset about it, have strong opinions and so on. But it also explains why it's a good thing to have around. There are very few emotional channels available to us that don't require proximity. It also explains why it's wrong to say that downvotes are inferior and should be replaced by comments. Imagine if people were forced to put every emotional gesture into words. It would be impossibly ponderous. And we'd end up talking about nothing else.

by adgar 15y ago

maratd 15y ago

> Not to mention that he's compromising on accuracy. Yeah, 1 second is tiny, but why give it up if you don't have to? While NGINX may use very little CPU and have minimal hard drive access, PHP (or Java/Python/Ruby/etc.) will hit those resources hard. Look, I'm not one of those environmentalist wackos who pisses his pants when somebody forgets to turn off a light ... but ... if you're keeping your BLOG server a hundred times busier than it has to be just so that your users don't experience a staleness of 1 second ... you're an asshole. A military or medical application, fine. But a blog? Sorry, no.

scott_s 15y ago
you're an asshole. Not necessary.
- adgar 15y ago
  > Not necessary. He might have a point if 100x is even close to a realistic increase... again, as demonstrated by other posts in this thread, this isn't the case.
  - gruseom 15y ago
    It's not about whether he has a point, it's about calling others assholes. In face-to-face conversation there are lots of ways to do that without being strident; in writing it's too heavy-handed. Scrupulously avoiding such aggressiveness is one of the few easy things we can do to prop up the discourse.
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]

gruseom 15y ago

downvoted with no explanation, cute. And readers here think they're above Reddit standards. Downvoting with no explanation is arguably acceptable here. There's disagreement about it, but people do it all the time, including me when I don't have time to type in a comment or feel like doing so would add more noise than signal (like, probably, right now). Complaining about being downvoted, though, definitely is not.

adgar 15y ago
How can explaining why you downvoted, when nobody else has, add more noise than signal, unless your opinion is not worth sharing in the first place? And if your opinion is not worth sharing, why is it worth a downvote? Let's be honest - we downvote here because we disagree, just like very other site.
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]
- gruseom 15y ago
  That's a good enough question that you've provoked me into figuring out what I think about this. Adding words takes up space. A downvote doesn't. Therefore a downvote is more lightweight, therefore there are times when it's more appropriate than a comment. It's an in-between gesture, partway between silence and verbalization. I like that subtlety. It's an especially good way to express disagreement with something one feels is not only wrong but also somehow debasing. A comment doesn't have to be rude to be debasing, it can just be mediocre or somehow crass, nor is one always able to say exactly how. Those are cases where fostering more discussion is unlikely to do good and it's better to hold one's tongue. But downvoting still gives a signal to the original commenter as well as to other readers that someone's not ok with what was said. I think that's meaningful, and also that it's fairly rare to see people abusing that signal. It does happen, but more often when someone thinks they don't deserve it, it's kind of obvious to others that really they do. So when it happens, the best way to respond is with a touch of self-honesty. Maybe you'll come out roses but just maybe you'll notice something worth correcting. One other thing about downvoting. I think what makes it controversial, and also interesting, is that it's an emotional expression. (Upvotes are too, but downvotes are stronger.) That explains why people get upset about it, have strong opinions and so on. But it also explains why it's a good thing to have around. There are very few emotional channels available to us that don't require proximity. It also explains why it's wrong to say that downvotes are inferior and should be replaced by comments. Imagine if people were forced to put every emotional gesture into words. It would be impossibly ponderous. And we'd end up talking about nothing else.