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This is a really nice combo, I agree. But… I think it’s safe to say it’ll probably remain niche forever. I wish there were more stacks like Clojure/Script. Wh

This is a really nice combo, I agree. But… I think it’s safe to say it’ll probably remain niche forever. I wish there were more stacks like Clojure/Script. While I’m wishing, I’d love to have a modern ML with simple tooling, a good stdlib like Go (with a high performance http server baked in), and a good full stack story that doesn’t produce a 1MB “hello world”, and doesn’t require 1K dependencies. Does anyone know what the closest thing to this is these days?

isaacimagine 5y ago
It's still a long way from being complete, but I'm working on something like that[0]. Eventual plans are to have good Rust library interop (e.g. bindings to hyper for http) while also being able to compile to Wasm (to run on an erlang-style distributed runtime / the browser). The language is currently interpreted, but one I get typechecking working, I should be able to merge in the Wasm codegen backend I'm working on (with eventual plans for LLVM). Current compiler has zero external dependencies. Language itself could be described as a mix of OCaml, Scheme, and Lua. Currently working on the hygienic procedural macro system and system injection through algebraic effects. [0]: https://github.com/vrtbl/passerine https://github.com/vrtbl/passerine
G4BB3R 5y ago
For the next year(s), take a look at Roc (https://roc-lang.org https://roc-lang.org). It is being developed by some folks from the Elm community, but it's focused on backend/CLI.
Zababa 5y ago
> While I’m wishing, I’d love to have a modern ML with simple tooling, a good stdlib like Go (with a high performance http server baked in), and a good full stack story that doesn’t produce a 1MB “hello world”, and doesn’t require 1K dependencies. I don't have anything close, but I would like the exact same thing. Especially since OCaml and F# both have JS compilers, you could easily have a fullstack app written with this language. I think your best bet might be either OCaml or F# these days if the ML part is the most important one, or Go if the rest is the most important part.
jwr 5y ago
> This is a really nice combo, I agree. But… I think it’s safe to say it’ll probably remain niche forever. "I don't like fruit — they are bitter and taste bad" "Here's a kiwi: it's sweet and tastes great!" "I think it's safe to say it'll probably remain niche forever. I wish I could get sweet fruit!" I don't know about others, but I don't get paid for non-nicheness of tools I use (nor, incidentally, for the small size of my "hello world"). I get paid by users who use the software that I develop, and I choose tools that allow me to effectively deliver good quality software. So I guess my decision process might be slightly different — but overall I have no reason to complain, because I'm doing great so far :-)

isaacimagine 5y ago

It's still a long way from being complete, but I'm working on something like that[0]. Eventual plans are to have good Rust library interop (e.g. bindings to hyper for http) while also being able to compile to Wasm (to run on an erlang-style distributed runtime / the browser). The language is currently interpreted, but one I get typechecking working, I should be able to merge in the Wasm codegen backend I'm working on (with eventual plans for LLVM). Current compiler has zero external dependencies. Language itself could be described as a mix of OCaml, Scheme, and Lua. Currently working on the hygienic procedural macro system and system injection through algebraic effects. [0]: https://github.com/vrtbl/passerine https://github.com/vrtbl/passerine

G4BB3R 5y ago

For the next year(s), take a look at Roc (https://roc-lang.org https://roc-lang.org). It is being developed by some folks from the Elm community, but it's focused on backend/CLI.

Zababa 5y ago

> While I’m wishing, I’d love to have a modern ML with simple tooling, a good stdlib like Go (with a high performance http server baked in), and a good full stack story that doesn’t produce a 1MB “hello world”, and doesn’t require 1K dependencies. I don't have anything close, but I would like the exact same thing. Especially since OCaml and F# both have JS compilers, you could easily have a fullstack app written with this language. I think your best bet might be either OCaml or F# these days if the ML part is the most important one, or Go if the rest is the most important part.

jwr 5y ago

> This is a really nice combo, I agree. But… I think it’s safe to say it’ll probably remain niche forever. "I don't like fruit — they are bitter and taste bad" "Here's a kiwi: it's sweet and tastes great!" "I think it's safe to say it'll probably remain niche forever. I wish I could get sweet fruit!" I don't know about others, but I don't get paid for non-nicheness of tools I use (nor, incidentally, for the small size of my "hello world"). I get paid by users who use the software that I develop, and I choose tools that allow me to effectively deliver good quality software. So I guess my decision process might be slightly different — but overall I have no reason to complain, because I'm doing great so far :-)