5 ms·
> Do you have an example of a company releasing an open source version of their secret sauce? The chip design itself should be the secret sauce. Not the tools
by rektide 5y ago
> Do you have an example of a company releasing an open source version of their secret sauce?
The chip design itself should be the secret sauce. Not the tools you make the chip with. Nvidia is resolutely not-contributing. Many other companies are starting to get onboard with open chip design. This doesn't mean the chips have to be open, but the tooling needs to be something shared & co-developable. If this is a little pet research project that's one thing, but there really needs to be ongoing workforce development, a strong advance. The NSF's TILOS, a strong alliance/nexus of researchers within & around the OpenROAD community, get this[1]:
> TILOS – The Institute for Learning-enabled Optimization at Scale – is an NSF National AI Research Institute for advances in optimization, partially supported by Intel Corporation. The institute began operations in November 2021 with a mission to "make impossible
optimizations possible, at scale and in practice".
> There are six universities in TILOS: UCSD, MIT, National University, Penn, UT-Austin, and Yale. The institute seeks a new nexus of AI and machine learning, optimization, and use in practice. Figure 4 shows four virtuous cycles envisioned for the institute: 1. mutual advances of AI and optimization provide the foundations; 2. challenges of scale, along with breakthroughs from scaling, bind together foundations and the use domains of chip design, networks and robotics; 3. the cycle of translation and impact brings research and the leading edge of practice closer together; and 4. the cycle of research, education, and broadening participation grows the field and its workforce.
The virtues written here are self evident & obvious. Trying to just get good yourself without trying to help advance the field, not participating, not taking advantages of scale of many working together, not participating in open research, the risks of having isolated teams, and not participating in cycles of development: whatever the nvidia or "publicly traded company" worlds think they're doing, they're missing out, and hurting everyone and especially themselves for this oldschool zero-sum competitive thinking.
There are plenty of company's releasing the chips too. Google's OpenTitan[2] security chip. WD's Swerv RISC-V core for their driver controller ARM R-series replacement[3]. Open standards if not chips like UCI for chiplets or CXL for interconnect are again examples of literally everyone but NVidia playing well together, trying for better, standardizing a future for participation & healthy competition & growth. Nvidia again and again is the company which simply will not play with others.
I challenge you to answer your own question in reverse: are any companies other than Nvidia embarking up AI/ML chipmaking in a closed fashion? There probably are, let's follow & watch them.
[1] https://theopenroadproject.org/news/leveling-up-a-trajectory-of-openroad-tilos-and-beyond/ https://theopenroadproject.org/news/leveling-up-a-trajectory...
[2] https://opentitan.org/ https://opentitan.org/
[3] https://github.com/chipsalliance/Cores-SweRV https://github.com/chipsalliance/Cores-SweRV
- xbmcuser 5y agoSo intel, TSMC and Samsung have open-sourced their chip manufacturing systems I did not know that. ASML is giving out lithography systems so anyone can make them.
- JustLurking2022 5y agoIf the tools to make it would more easily allow others to achieve similarly efficient designs, then that is the secret sauce...
- Cyph0n 5y ago> The chip design itself should be the secret sauce. Not the tools you make the chip with. I’m sure Cadence, Synopsys, and Mentor would love to hear more about this.
- rektide 5y agoEveryone keeps hammering home how much of the process is proprietary. Whose interest is that in though? Is it in Nvidias & Intels & Qualcomm's interest to let these chip design software companies have extremely proprietary cake, that no one can advance or enhance, that has no machine-learning capabilities surrounding it? To me it feels like so many are missing the picture here. Chip designers ought to cooperate on tooling, to burst exactly this batch of crooks you've just cited's game. Designers should stop being held back by limited, small minded, heavily controlled proprietary software, & collaborate on making a better tooled world we can all openly advance. Some day I hope we have similar overthrows of ASML & other layers of the stack, as what's happening in chip design now (for basically everyone except nvidia and apple, the two behemoths). Competition & cooperation mixing at various levels is good, is healthy, keeps the world from ossifying. Edit: oh look, a comment full of these same proprietary chip-design-software companies (not chip-designers) trying to make ML software! https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31092673 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31092673
- _jal 5y agoLet the tooling classes tremble at an open source revolution. The chip designers have nothing to lose but their chains. They have a world to win. Fabbing Folks of All Countries, Unite!