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This same DMCA company (WorthIT Solutions) previously tried to DMCA the php docs range function page on behalf of HackerRank [0]. Pretty crazy. [0]: https://ww

This same DMCA company (WorthIT Solutions) previously tried to DMCA the php docs range function page on behalf of HackerRank [0]. Pretty crazy. [0]: https://www.mail-archive.com/php-webmaster@lists.php.net/msg14947.html https://www.mail-archive.com/php-webmaster@lists.php.net/msg...

RcouF1uZ4gsC 4y ago
One way for HackerRank to do the right thing would be to sue WorthIT for breach of contract and loss of reputation. Their contract must have included some requirements for due diligence on filing those notices, and having these bogus DMCA notices does hurt HackerRank’s reputation, especially with its target audience. Only way to make this stop is make companies like WorthIT feel financial pain from their actions.
- blurbleblurble 4y ago
  There's also an argument to be made that this is on HackerRank. Just because they're using a contractor to do the dirty work doesn't excuse them from responsibility for this sloppiness.
  - paulgb 4y ago
    Especially given that the false takedown of the PHP docs dates back to January. Issuing false takedowns against organizations whose code you use for free is a pretty bad look. (It's also a pretty crummy product, I used to use it as an interviewer and am glad I no longer have to.)
    - rvivek 4y ago
      Sorry to hear. I just sent you a note. Appreciate your response.
    - threatofrain 4y ago
      May we hear more about why it’s a poor product?
      - paulgb 4y ago
        To his credit, the CEO read my comment and reached out to me (as he noted in the sibling comment). Since that email answers your question, and also adds some useful context, I'll just share that: > So, I generally have a personal rule against disparaging things that other people made because I know how hard it is to make stuff and how criticism feels. I ignored that rule in this instance only because I've been a victim of DMCA misuse from a company and have learned the hard way that the only real repercussions anyone will face are reputational. > For context on my experience with HackerRank, I have used both the take-home test product and the real-time test product. It has been almost a year since I have used either, since I left that job. > I found the real-time product frustrating to use; frequently I could not rely on the candidate seeing the same state I did. I forget exactly what the problem was but candidates were often confused by the console not appearing and things like that. In some instances, either I or candidates were booted out of an interview in progress and had to refresh the page. Usually we worked it out pretty quickly, but losing precious time can make candidates nervous and it's not a great first experience with the company for them. I also found that code execution ran slowly, in both the real-time product and the take-home test -- we weren't running big programs, I'm not sure what was so slow. > On the take-home side, for context, I was one of several people responsible for the take-home coding test for my department and was also (unofficially) the go-to person to look into assignments that were flagged for plagiarism. I found the plagiarism detection results to be pretty incomprehensible -- sometimes I'd see tests with very high plagiarism scores and no signs of obvious plagiarism, or things like a 90% score with just a few innocuous lines of overlap with the alleged source. I understand that flagging false positives for human review is generally preferred here to false negatives, but my main concern here is that if recruiters within an organization take these numbers at face value, they end up rejecting candidates pretty much randomly, or because the candidate wrote idiomatic code that looks like everyone else's because it's the idiomatic solution in that language.
        b20000 4y ago
  - Semiapies 4y ago
    Yes, there seems to be a need to blame the lawyers and not the company engaging those lawyers.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - throwaway2037 4y ago
    This is how the US Sarbanes–Oxley Act works. During giant accounting scandals in late 1990s / early 2000s, corps were using the onion approach with external vendors to cover-up shady/illegal practices. SOA basically says "no" to this now. We need the same for DMCA.
- briandear 4y ago
  Another way to make it stop is for companies to stop using HackerRank.
- foobiekr 4y ago
  You’re assuming that this company is actually a separate entity and not some sketchy relatives of the hackerrank management providing for international cover for their bogus DMCA attacks. Which is exactly what it is.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
orangepurple 4y ago
Not only that but the ENTIRE TEAM SECTION ON THEIR WEBSITE (worthitsolutions.co) IS A BLATANT LIE. Not one of those people is real. Every single biography link leads to Lorem Ipsum. It's a shady, secretive sweatshop operating out of Lahore, Pakistan.
- p5a0u9l 4y ago
  Yup, and a couple of the stock photos of "Our team" are duplicates. Crazy. How does an outfit like this get hired?
  - b20000 4y ago
    well, how did HR get through YC?
    - mkl 4y ago
      They're talking about the company HackerRank hired to do DMCA takedowns, Worthit Solutions.
      - b20000 4y ago
        i know
    - orangepurple 4y ago
      You don't become a billionaire by writing too many checks. Hence why they outsourced their goon squad to Pakistan.
      - b20000 4y ago
        that is not what i asked. why did YC fund hackerrank? sounds like a shitty idea and bad for our industry.
        behringer 4y ago
EdwardDiego 4y ago
Haha wow. What hurts my soul the most is that there is no penalty, legal, financial or reputational, for this kind of bogus behaviour, like how Sony's YT bots keep claiming ownership of any performance or recording of a piece of classical music because they hold copyright over one particular recording of that piece. The fact that there isn't any downside just shows what poor legislation the DMCA is. If you told me that the DMCA was written entirely by the music copyright industry and handed to compliant congress members to rubber stamp, I'm likely to believe you.

RcouF1uZ4gsC 4y ago

One way for HackerRank to do the right thing would be to sue WorthIT for breach of contract and loss of reputation. Their contract must have included some requirements for due diligence on filing those notices, and having these bogus DMCA notices does hurt HackerRank’s reputation, especially with its target audience. Only way to make this stop is make companies like WorthIT feel financial pain from their actions.

blurbleblurble 4y ago
There's also an argument to be made that this is on HackerRank. Just because they're using a contractor to do the dirty work doesn't excuse them from responsibility for this sloppiness.
- paulgb 4y ago
  Especially given that the false takedown of the PHP docs dates back to January. Issuing false takedowns against organizations whose code you use for free is a pretty bad look. (It's also a pretty crummy product, I used to use it as an interviewer and am glad I no longer have to.)
  - rvivek 4y ago
    Sorry to hear. I just sent you a note. Appreciate your response.
  - threatofrain 4y ago
    May we hear more about why it’s a poor product?
    - paulgb 4y ago
      To his credit, the CEO read my comment and reached out to me (as he noted in the sibling comment). Since that email answers your question, and also adds some useful context, I'll just share that: > So, I generally have a personal rule against disparaging things that other people made because I know how hard it is to make stuff and how criticism feels. I ignored that rule in this instance only because I've been a victim of DMCA misuse from a company and have learned the hard way that the only real repercussions anyone will face are reputational. > For context on my experience with HackerRank, I have used both the take-home test product and the real-time test product. It has been almost a year since I have used either, since I left that job. > I found the real-time product frustrating to use; frequently I could not rely on the candidate seeing the same state I did. I forget exactly what the problem was but candidates were often confused by the console not appearing and things like that. In some instances, either I or candidates were booted out of an interview in progress and had to refresh the page. Usually we worked it out pretty quickly, but losing precious time can make candidates nervous and it's not a great first experience with the company for them. I also found that code execution ran slowly, in both the real-time product and the take-home test -- we weren't running big programs, I'm not sure what was so slow. > On the take-home side, for context, I was one of several people responsible for the take-home coding test for my department and was also (unofficially) the go-to person to look into assignments that were flagged for plagiarism. I found the plagiarism detection results to be pretty incomprehensible -- sometimes I'd see tests with very high plagiarism scores and no signs of obvious plagiarism, or things like a 90% score with just a few innocuous lines of overlap with the alleged source. I understand that flagging false positives for human review is generally preferred here to false negatives, but my main concern here is that if recruiters within an organization take these numbers at face value, they end up rejecting candidates pretty much randomly, or because the candidate wrote idiomatic code that looks like everyone else's because it's the idiomatic solution in that language.
      - b20000 4y ago
- Semiapies 4y ago
  Yes, there seems to be a need to blame the lawyers and not the company engaging those lawyers.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- throwaway2037 4y ago
  This is how the US Sarbanes–Oxley Act works. During giant accounting scandals in late 1990s / early 2000s, corps were using the onion approach with external vendors to cover-up shady/illegal practices. SOA basically says "no" to this now. We need the same for DMCA.
briandear 4y ago
Another way to make it stop is for companies to stop using HackerRank.
foobiekr 4y ago
You’re assuming that this company is actually a separate entity and not some sketchy relatives of the hackerrank management providing for international cover for their bogus DMCA attacks. Which is exactly what it is.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

orangepurple 4y ago

Not only that but the ENTIRE TEAM SECTION ON THEIR WEBSITE (worthitsolutions.co) IS A BLATANT LIE. Not one of those people is real. Every single biography link leads to Lorem Ipsum. It's a shady, secretive sweatshop operating out of Lahore, Pakistan.

p5a0u9l 4y ago
Yup, and a couple of the stock photos of "Our team" are duplicates. Crazy. How does an outfit like this get hired?
- b20000 4y ago
  well, how did HR get through YC?
  - mkl 4y ago
    They're talking about the company HackerRank hired to do DMCA takedowns, Worthit Solutions.
    - b20000 4y ago
      i know
  - orangepurple 4y ago
    You don't become a billionaire by writing too many checks. Hence why they outsourced their goon squad to Pakistan.
    - b20000 4y ago
      that is not what i asked. why did YC fund hackerrank? sounds like a shitty idea and bad for our industry.
      - behringer 4y ago

EdwardDiego 4y ago

Haha wow. What hurts my soul the most is that there is no penalty, legal, financial or reputational, for this kind of bogus behaviour, like how Sony's YT bots keep claiming ownership of any performance or recording of a piece of classical music because they hold copyright over one particular recording of that piece. The fact that there isn't any downside just shows what poor legislation the DMCA is. If you told me that the DMCA was written entirely by the music copyright industry and handed to compliant congress members to rubber stamp, I'm likely to believe you.