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> keep the tax system complicated what happened to the original forces that created this mess. I am not convinced that if it wasn't for intuit we would have a

> keep the tax system complicated what happened to the original forces that created this mess. I am not convinced that if it wasn't for intuit we would have a simple tax system. > The majority of the civilized world spends almost 0 time doing personal taxes. this isn't actually true.

micromacrofoot 5y ago
> this isn't actually true There are at least 50 countries with less complex taxes than the united states
- dominotw 5y ago
  ok? What does that have to do with original 'almost 0 time' claim? Also complexity of american tax code didn't come because of turbotax/intuit. Do you really think we have stuff like credits for home improvements, credits for student loan payments ect are in tax code because of intuit? There are politicians right now trying to cram in more and more tax code because those incentives are incredible popular with American public. All this is not because of intuit.
  - micromacrofoot 5y ago
    You got me "almost 0" was hyperbolic, I'll be more specific: In multiple countries personal taxes can be completed with little more than a signature, and most are simpler in general... the US ranks near the bottom in terms of complexity. I didn't say that Intuit caused complex taxes, I said they actively lobby to keep them complicated. Intuit spends millions on lobbying every year (against simplification efforts, as well as efforts for the government to create its own free digital tax filing system) and has recently pulled out of a federal free tax filing program, and are being sued by the FTC for their use of "free" in their marketing and performing bait and switch.
    - dominotw 5y ago
      > I didn't say that Intuit caused complex taxes, I said they actively lobby to keep them complicated. they do? I know they lobby against free website. But i don't see why they nee to lobby for complicated tax code since all the tax exemptions and complexity is widely popular with american public. I cant imagine a politican running on removing home improvement exemptions to simplify tax code.
      - micromacrofoot 5y ago
        They've specifically lobbied against automatic filing on multiple occasions, spanning several administrations, and they've also lobbied against tax code simplification. Are you engaging in this conversation to seek more information, or in an attempt to defend Intuit? most of these answers are a simple google away.
        dominotw 5y ago
        > Are you engaging in this conversation to seek more information, or in an attempt to defend Intuit? most of these answers are a simple google away. yes i am trying to find how they `lobbied against tax code simplification.` . All the links are pointing to how they lobbied against govt run tax filing system. eg: https://www.propublica.org/article/inside-turbotax-20-year-fight-to-stop-americans-from-filing-their-taxes-for-free https://www.propublica.org/article/inside-turbotax-20-year-f...
        micromacrofoot 5y ago
        Again, this isn't hard. You can't oppose an argument by coming here and saying "it wasn't in the first google result" Same source, different article mentions Intuit's opposition to return-free filing: https://www.propublica.org/article/how-the-maker-of-turbotax-fought-free-simple-tax-filing https://www.propublica.org/article/how-the-maker-of-turbotax...
        dominotw 5y ago

micromacrofoot 5y ago

> this isn't actually true There are at least 50 countries with less complex taxes than the united states

dominotw 5y ago
ok? What does that have to do with original 'almost 0 time' claim? Also complexity of american tax code didn't come because of turbotax/intuit. Do you really think we have stuff like credits for home improvements, credits for student loan payments ect are in tax code because of intuit? There are politicians right now trying to cram in more and more tax code because those incentives are incredible popular with American public. All this is not because of intuit.
- micromacrofoot 5y ago
  You got me "almost 0" was hyperbolic, I'll be more specific: In multiple countries personal taxes can be completed with little more than a signature, and most are simpler in general... the US ranks near the bottom in terms of complexity. I didn't say that Intuit caused complex taxes, I said they actively lobby to keep them complicated. Intuit spends millions on lobbying every year (against simplification efforts, as well as efforts for the government to create its own free digital tax filing system) and has recently pulled out of a federal free tax filing program, and are being sued by the FTC for their use of "free" in their marketing and performing bait and switch.
  - dominotw 5y ago
    > I didn't say that Intuit caused complex taxes, I said they actively lobby to keep them complicated. they do? I know they lobby against free website. But i don't see why they nee to lobby for complicated tax code since all the tax exemptions and complexity is widely popular with american public. I cant imagine a politican running on removing home improvement exemptions to simplify tax code.
    - micromacrofoot 5y ago
      They've specifically lobbied against automatic filing on multiple occasions, spanning several administrations, and they've also lobbied against tax code simplification. Are you engaging in this conversation to seek more information, or in an attempt to defend Intuit? most of these answers are a simple google away.
      - dominotw 5y ago
        > Are you engaging in this conversation to seek more information, or in an attempt to defend Intuit? most of these answers are a simple google away. yes i am trying to find how they `lobbied against tax code simplification.` . All the links are pointing to how they lobbied against govt run tax filing system. eg: https://www.propublica.org/article/inside-turbotax-20-year-fight-to-stop-americans-from-filing-their-taxes-for-free https://www.propublica.org/article/inside-turbotax-20-year-f...
        micromacrofoot 5y ago
        Again, this isn't hard. You can't oppose an argument by coming here and saying "it wasn't in the first google result" Same source, different article mentions Intuit's opposition to return-free filing: https://www.propublica.org/article/how-the-maker-of-turbotax-fought-free-simple-tax-filing https://www.propublica.org/article/how-the-maker-of-turbotax...
        dominotw 5y ago