5 ms·

I would be interested in knowing which country you live in? Can you elaborate what makes you say cars are better?

by nicoco 4y ago

mijamo 4y ago
I don't own a car and live in a very cycling friendly place, but even I have to admit that a car is very convenient : - you can transport several person at once. If you have kids this is very valuable. - can go longer distances. I wouldn't go more than 15km on my bike as a mean of transportation, as opposed to as an activity in itself - you don't get wet when it rains - you can actually transport stuff. I do my regular shopping on my bike but for gardening I need to rent a car. Same for several things (large packs of stuff, pet food etc.) - you are just more free to go wherever, especially on a weekend. With public transport you are very limited and can't access a lot of wild places. I actually force myself to rent a car once a month so that I go around to different places and not restrict myself to my immediate surroundings and what I can access with public transport. That said, I do not plan to own a car as long as I live in a major city, it is just financially unsound and not really needed for me on a daily basis as I don't have kids.
- gernb 4y ago
  I ran into this issue moving from the USA (owning a car for 15yrs) to another country where public transportation is the norm. Lived without a car for 15yrs. For the most part I didn't miss the car. I just took it as "life". But, a few friends owned a car and a few times a year I'd met up with them and notice that my world seemed 4x larger with car. They were going all over the place because it was easy and comfortable and while I wasn't a hermit I stuck to easy to get to places. I also joined a surfing group and the person that ran it owned a van and we would not have been able to get to the various beaches without it in any reasonable time frame using public transportation. Another area was running errands. Back in car centric USA I might spend a Saturday going to 3-5 places (Home Depot, Costco, Target, the Mall) and at each place I might buy something I needed and just put it in the trunk and carry on. Where as in my 2nd life I could only go to a single store in a day because I needed to carry what I bought. Maybe that's good but it felt frustating not to be able to get shit done as quickly. Sometimes I could order or have things shipped but it took an extra 10 minutes to fill out the forms, more if there's a line, and then I had to be home to receive the packages.
ars 4y ago
You can't take passengers in a bike. (Edit: Fixed, thanks agumonkey.) You can't transport large or bulky items. You are limited in how much you can transport (how much can fit in your backpack basically). You can't safely store things. The value of a mobile location to store items is vastly overlooked by people who hate cars. Cars are faster if you are going more than about a mile - even including parking. You can't ride a bike in bad weather. Hard rain is very unpleasant, and snow is impossible. If you live in a place with hills, bikes are just not practical. Bumps in the road, potholes, etc, are very dangerous in a bike. There's a spot near me that has these "ripples" in the pavement that you can't easily see, and I fell after going on them, now I know to avoid them, but any new biker will also fall.
- agumonkey 4y ago
  > You can't take passengers in a car. You can take passengers in a car ;) the carriage limit is real, the mobile storage aspect is true too, weather is nasty
- gamegoblin 4y ago
  > You can't take passengers in a bike. Mostly true, though plenty of bikes can haul 1-2 kids or 1 extra adult. There is a guy in my neighborhood I see take his kids to school every day in one of these. https://www.theverge.com/2019/8/8/20791435/radwagon-electric-cargo-bike-review-car-replacement https://www.theverge.com/2019/8/8/20791435/radwagon-electric... > You can't transport large or bulky items. Cargo bikes or bike trailers are extremely nice in flat cities, and even in hilly cities, e-bikes make them feasible. I routinely haul 100lbs up hills in Seattle with a trailer behind an e-bike. Here's an article by (admittedly a bit of a bike fanatic) about hauling patio sets, stoves, grills, etc. https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2014/06/23/how-to-carry-major-appliances-on-your-bike/ https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2014/06/23/how-to-carry-majo... > You can't safely store things This is a good point and I think your observation about how it's overlooked is important. Going on multi-store trips in a bike is mildly annoying since you often have to take what you got from one store into the next store because you can't leave it on your bike. > Cars are faster if you are going more than about a mile - even including parking. This is highly dependent on the city you're in. In Seattle, bike is, by far, the fastest way for me to commute. My commute is 6 miles (West Seattle to Downtown). Biking, door-to-door, is 25 minutes. It's 35 minutes by bus or car. This is because a large chunk of the trip is on a dedicated use bike trail without stop lights or traffic. > You can't ride a bike in bad weather Amsterdam has pretty bad weather (it rains 50% of days of the year), yet somehow they have extremely high cycling rates. For me (in Seattle, also lots of rain), the game changer was getting a proper bike poncho: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLM_mTUuHlc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLM_mTUuHlc I agree that a torrential downpour like what you might get in the midwest is not realistic to cycle in. But for light to medium rain, the poncho punches above its weight. > snow is impossible They make it work in Finland https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uhx-26GfCBU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uhx-26GfCBU > If you live in a place with hills, bikes are just not practical. Seattle and SF are both quite hilly, yet both have among the highest rates of cycle usage. This is a barrier for those starting from a low level of fitness, though. And even for otherwise fit people, it takes a few weeks for your legs to adjust to the new movement pattern. E-bikes make hills trivial, though, which is why they are exploding in popularity (in Seattle at least). > Bumps in the road, potholes, etc, are very dangerous in a bike. Agreed. This is one of the reasons it's so important to have dedicated bike infrastructure. Road damage is proportional to the 4th power (!!) of a vehicle's weight. So cyclist infrastructure, once built, degrades extremely slowly compared to car infrastructure.

I would be interested in knowing which country you live in? Can you elaborate what makes you say cars are better?

by nicoco 4y ago

I would be interested in knowing which country you live in? Can you elaborate what makes you say cars are better?

I don't own a car and live in a very cycling friendly place, but even I have to admit that a car is very convenient : - you can transport several person at once. If you have kids this is very valuable. - can go longer distances. I wouldn't go more than 15km on my bike as a mean of transportation, as opposed to as an activity in itself - you don't get wet when it rains - you can actually transport stuff. I do my regular shopping on my bike but for gardening I need to rent a car. Same for several things (large packs of stuff, pet food etc.) - you are just more free to go wherever, especially on a weekend. With public transport you are very limited and can't access a lot of wild places. I actually force myself to rent a car once a month so that I go around to different places and not restrict myself to my immediate surroundings and what I can access with public transport. That said, I do not plan to own a car as long as I live in a major city, it is just financially unsound and not really needed for me on a daily basis as I don't have kids.

gernb 4y ago
I ran into this issue moving from the USA (owning a car for 15yrs) to another country where public transportation is the norm. Lived without a car for 15yrs. For the most part I didn't miss the car. I just took it as "life". But, a few friends owned a car and a few times a year I'd met up with them and notice that my world seemed 4x larger with car. They were going all over the place because it was easy and comfortable and while I wasn't a hermit I stuck to easy to get to places. I also joined a surfing group and the person that ran it owned a van and we would not have been able to get to the various beaches without it in any reasonable time frame using public transportation. Another area was running errands. Back in car centric USA I might spend a Saturday going to 3-5 places (Home Depot, Costco, Target, the Mall) and at each place I might buy something I needed and just put it in the trunk and carry on. Where as in my 2nd life I could only go to a single store in a day because I needed to carry what I bought. Maybe that's good but it felt frustating not to be able to get shit done as quickly. Sometimes I could order or have things shipped but it took an extra 10 minutes to fill out the forms, more if there's a line, and then I had to be home to receive the packages.

ars 4y ago

You can't take passengers in a bike. (Edit: Fixed, thanks agumonkey.) You can't transport large or bulky items. You are limited in how much you can transport (how much can fit in your backpack basically). You can't safely store things. The value of a mobile location to store items is vastly overlooked by people who hate cars. Cars are faster if you are going more than about a mile - even including parking. You can't ride a bike in bad weather. Hard rain is very unpleasant, and snow is impossible. If you live in a place with hills, bikes are just not practical. Bumps in the road, potholes, etc, are very dangerous in a bike. There's a spot near me that has these "ripples" in the pavement that you can't easily see, and I fell after going on them, now I know to avoid them, but any new biker will also fall.

agumonkey 4y ago
> You can't take passengers in a car. You can take passengers in a car ;) the carriage limit is real, the mobile storage aspect is true too, weather is nasty
gamegoblin 4y ago
> You can't take passengers in a bike. Mostly true, though plenty of bikes can haul 1-2 kids or 1 extra adult. There is a guy in my neighborhood I see take his kids to school every day in one of these. https://www.theverge.com/2019/8/8/20791435/radwagon-electric-cargo-bike-review-car-replacement https://www.theverge.com/2019/8/8/20791435/radwagon-electric... > You can't transport large or bulky items. Cargo bikes or bike trailers are extremely nice in flat cities, and even in hilly cities, e-bikes make them feasible. I routinely haul 100lbs up hills in Seattle with a trailer behind an e-bike. Here's an article by (admittedly a bit of a bike fanatic) about hauling patio sets, stoves, grills, etc. https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2014/06/23/how-to-carry-major-appliances-on-your-bike/ https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2014/06/23/how-to-carry-majo... > You can't safely store things This is a good point and I think your observation about how it's overlooked is important. Going on multi-store trips in a bike is mildly annoying since you often have to take what you got from one store into the next store because you can't leave it on your bike. > Cars are faster if you are going more than about a mile - even including parking. This is highly dependent on the city you're in. In Seattle, bike is, by far, the fastest way for me to commute. My commute is 6 miles (West Seattle to Downtown). Biking, door-to-door, is 25 minutes. It's 35 minutes by bus or car. This is because a large chunk of the trip is on a dedicated use bike trail without stop lights or traffic. > You can't ride a bike in bad weather Amsterdam has pretty bad weather (it rains 50% of days of the year), yet somehow they have extremely high cycling rates. For me (in Seattle, also lots of rain), the game changer was getting a proper bike poncho: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLM_mTUuHlc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLM_mTUuHlc I agree that a torrential downpour like what you might get in the midwest is not realistic to cycle in. But for light to medium rain, the poncho punches above its weight. > snow is impossible They make it work in Finland https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uhx-26GfCBU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uhx-26GfCBU > If you live in a place with hills, bikes are just not practical. Seattle and SF are both quite hilly, yet both have among the highest rates of cycle usage. This is a barrier for those starting from a low level of fitness, though. And even for otherwise fit people, it takes a few weeks for your legs to adjust to the new movement pattern. E-bikes make hills trivial, though, which is why they are exploding in popularity (in Seattle at least). > Bumps in the road, potholes, etc, are very dangerous in a bike. Agreed. This is one of the reasons it's so important to have dedicated bike infrastructure. Road damage is proportional to the 4th power (!!) of a vehicle's weight. So cyclist infrastructure, once built, degrades extremely slowly compared to car infrastructure.