5 ms·

> There is a massive contingent of people that HATE autistic people and feel like it's something to be "fixed". A lot of them frame that hate as helping. I sus

> There is a massive contingent of people that HATE autistic people and feel like it's something to be "fixed". A lot of them frame that hate as helping. I suspect this has something to do with the fact that many of these have grown up in environments where you are good at technical stuff or you are less than those who are (i.e. the US). They know that many autists will straight smoke their ass in all things STEM and they deeply resent being dealt a losing hand to those "weirdos". Others are just straight up sadists/abusers. The more I hear stories like this, the more I believe the courts practically seek out these sick fucks to be "caregivers" and such. Something is pathologically wrong with this entire area of society.

TeaDrunk 4y ago
> the more I believe the courts practically seek out these sick fucks to be "caregivers" and such I suspect its worse than that. I suspect courts don't care if the caregiver is a sick fuck, because the sick fuck is offering to fix the problem of a disabled person existing with needs.
- 77pt77 4y ago
  The courts just want someone other than the state to take care of the problem. That's mostly it.
spacemanmatt 4y ago
"autist" is generally regarded as derogatory, BTW.
- psyc 4y ago
  Whatever. My brother and I are both autists and its our favorite term, because it's funny. I gauge the general level of respect from the context.
  - spacemanmatt 4y ago
    You're welcome to it, of course. Doesn't change the way it's received by most of us!
    - psyc 4y ago
      I retract the “whatever” part. I shouldn’t have been rude.
- teddyh 4y ago
  So, what is the latest term from the euphemism treadmill, then?
  - psyc 4y ago
    We can’t decide between ‘autistic person’ and ‘person with autism’ but I gather the former is in the lead. Will get back to you after we sort it at the next AutistiCon.
    - faeriechangling 4y ago
      I think there's is a schism on that point between self-advocating Autistics and Parents of Autistics with more severe issues. The former is indeed in the lead however.
  - spacemanmatt 4y ago
    Ok, I wasn't saying it's a tired euphemism. I was saying it's a mean slur used by bigots. I don't totally understand your challenge to provide the latest term, honestly. Are you trying to cast me as the language police?
    - teddyh 4y ago
      > I was saying it's a mean slur used by bigots. […] Are you trying to cast me as the language police? What, exactly, does the language police do differently from what you did?
      - spacemanmatt 4y ago
        I don't know what the language police would do. I'm just asking what it makes you, if you use the language of bigots unironically.
        teddyh 4y ago
        We all use the language of bigots; viz. English.
- stuntkite 4y ago
  I self apply and I also use sperg only on myself. Hell, I use the r word self applied if I'm with friends... if I'm with people that might be offended though I call myself "advanced" but I just imagine the finger quotes and tap them with my feet a little bit splay and quiet twice but I think frequently people miss the timing of the joke and slur. But if someone compares me to anyone from Big Bang Theory I go off on a rant until they are glazed over about how I'm not trying to diminish the atrocities of slavery or how wrong minstrel shows are but also this is for sure "nerd face" and then wait... just wait... for way later in the party and say bazinga. Just kidding with the bazinga thing. I'd never say that. It disgusts me.
  - faeriechangling 4y ago
    I suspect "sperg" will get eaten by the euphemism treadmill long before "Autist" ever will be just because the concept of "Aspergers" is medically passe and it's namesake is a rather disagreeable fascist who was perfectly willing to send off any autistic he did not deem worthy off to get murdered by the Nazis amongst other issues and the ones he did deem worthy he considered to be psychopaths.
- faeriechangling 4y ago
  "Autist" has this sort of duality to it best demonstrated by wallstreetbets culture, where an "Autist" is somebody who will either lose all their money or get wealthy beyond compare. An object of mockery yet an object of admiration, an Elon Musk figure. Simply stigmatizing whatever words people decide to use in a mean way isn't a real solution to any problem. I resist sacrificing the word "Autist" to the god of the euphemism treadmill because it's the noun form of "Autistic" and is two syllables. If we stigmatize that word we won't address the actual stigma but we will be forced to resort to more pained and awkward language.
  - spacemanmatt 4y ago
    It is the most common term I hear from people who "call out" autism disingenuously. It's not about the words or the stigma, it's about the assholes and not repeating their abuse by reusing their words.
    - faeriechangling 4y ago
      >It's not about the words... it's about... their words. Feels somewhat contradictory. In terms of abuse, stigmatizing the word "Autist" won't prevent abuse, it will enable it. Language that expresses negative feelings about a group of people will always exist, all one can do is have influence over the exact language that is used in that expression and the context in which people use certain language. Censorship doesn't stop abuse, it changes how abuse is expressed. In this situation, if we censor "autist", people will still probably continue to use the word, but use it in private more often, and it will become more of a pure slur. People who use the word "Autist" also use "Autistic" as in "Autistic screeching" as a slur/backhanded compliment (And autistic is truly uncensorable) with a very similar connotation, so by stigmatizing "Autist" and giving it a more severe connotation consequently, you are actually increasing peoples ability to more fluently express their distaste of autistics by making the word "Autist" more distinct from "Autistic". Increasing peoples ability to express their distaste for autism more easily is the opposite of what censorship ought to aim to do.
      - 4y ago
psyc 4y ago
There was this popular kid in my senior year of high school. Class clown, well dressed, one of the star athletes. We'd been friends in 7th grade but he'd apparently forgotten and didn't talk to me. I was occasionally fodder for his loud jokes in front of the whole class, although the gay kid got it a lot worse than I did. One day I was fixing one of the computers in the office and he happened by. Nobody was around. He saw what I was doing and apropos of nothing he launched into something like, "You know, this place doesn't matter. Nothing here is real. Out there, a few years from now, you'll be in college, or working for fucking Microsoft or some shit. You know where I'll be? I'll be driving a forklift or changing somebody's oil if I'm lucky." No jokes. No smile.
- ctime 4y ago
  Well? Was he right? The suspense is terrible, I hope it lasts.
  - psyc 4y ago
    I left it out because I struggled with how to say it and still don’t know the right way to tell it. I did become a software developer, and I did greatly enjoy my time at Microsoft. It wasn’t happily ever after, but at least it was happily until it wasn’t. He died 15 years later of a brain injury he sustained in a car accident that occurred around the same time we had that encounter. Just awful luck, having nothing to do with anything. I totaled my first car too, only difference was I didn’t hit my head the same way.
- 77pt77 4y ago
  Except he is wrong. It is very real.

TeaDrunk 4y ago

> the more I believe the courts practically seek out these sick fucks to be "caregivers" and such I suspect its worse than that. I suspect courts don't care if the caregiver is a sick fuck, because the sick fuck is offering to fix the problem of a disabled person existing with needs.

77pt77 4y ago
The courts just want someone other than the state to take care of the problem. That's mostly it.

spacemanmatt 4y ago

"autist" is generally regarded as derogatory, BTW.

psyc 4y ago
Whatever. My brother and I are both autists and its our favorite term, because it's funny. I gauge the general level of respect from the context.
- spacemanmatt 4y ago
  You're welcome to it, of course. Doesn't change the way it's received by most of us!
  - psyc 4y ago
    I retract the “whatever” part. I shouldn’t have been rude.
teddyh 4y ago
So, what is the latest term from the euphemism treadmill, then?
- psyc 4y ago
  We can’t decide between ‘autistic person’ and ‘person with autism’ but I gather the former is in the lead. Will get back to you after we sort it at the next AutistiCon.
  - faeriechangling 4y ago
    I think there's is a schism on that point between self-advocating Autistics and Parents of Autistics with more severe issues. The former is indeed in the lead however.
- spacemanmatt 4y ago
  Ok, I wasn't saying it's a tired euphemism. I was saying it's a mean slur used by bigots. I don't totally understand your challenge to provide the latest term, honestly. Are you trying to cast me as the language police?
  - teddyh 4y ago
    > I was saying it's a mean slur used by bigots. […] Are you trying to cast me as the language police? What, exactly, does the language police do differently from what you did?
    - spacemanmatt 4y ago
      I don't know what the language police would do. I'm just asking what it makes you, if you use the language of bigots unironically.
      - teddyh 4y ago
        We all use the language of bigots; viz. English.
stuntkite 4y ago
I self apply and I also use sperg only on myself. Hell, I use the r word self applied if I'm with friends... if I'm with people that might be offended though I call myself "advanced" but I just imagine the finger quotes and tap them with my feet a little bit splay and quiet twice but I think frequently people miss the timing of the joke and slur. But if someone compares me to anyone from Big Bang Theory I go off on a rant until they are glazed over about how I'm not trying to diminish the atrocities of slavery or how wrong minstrel shows are but also this is for sure "nerd face" and then wait... just wait... for way later in the party and say bazinga. Just kidding with the bazinga thing. I'd never say that. It disgusts me.
- faeriechangling 4y ago
  I suspect "sperg" will get eaten by the euphemism treadmill long before "Autist" ever will be just because the concept of "Aspergers" is medically passe and it's namesake is a rather disagreeable fascist who was perfectly willing to send off any autistic he did not deem worthy off to get murdered by the Nazis amongst other issues and the ones he did deem worthy he considered to be psychopaths.
faeriechangling 4y ago
"Autist" has this sort of duality to it best demonstrated by wallstreetbets culture, where an "Autist" is somebody who will either lose all their money or get wealthy beyond compare. An object of mockery yet an object of admiration, an Elon Musk figure. Simply stigmatizing whatever words people decide to use in a mean way isn't a real solution to any problem. I resist sacrificing the word "Autist" to the god of the euphemism treadmill because it's the noun form of "Autistic" and is two syllables. If we stigmatize that word we won't address the actual stigma but we will be forced to resort to more pained and awkward language.
- spacemanmatt 4y ago
  It is the most common term I hear from people who "call out" autism disingenuously. It's not about the words or the stigma, it's about the assholes and not repeating their abuse by reusing their words.
  - faeriechangling 4y ago
    >It's not about the words... it's about... their words. Feels somewhat contradictory. In terms of abuse, stigmatizing the word "Autist" won't prevent abuse, it will enable it. Language that expresses negative feelings about a group of people will always exist, all one can do is have influence over the exact language that is used in that expression and the context in which people use certain language. Censorship doesn't stop abuse, it changes how abuse is expressed. In this situation, if we censor "autist", people will still probably continue to use the word, but use it in private more often, and it will become more of a pure slur. People who use the word "Autist" also use "Autistic" as in "Autistic screeching" as a slur/backhanded compliment (And autistic is truly uncensorable) with a very similar connotation, so by stigmatizing "Autist" and giving it a more severe connotation consequently, you are actually increasing peoples ability to more fluently express their distaste of autistics by making the word "Autist" more distinct from "Autistic". Increasing peoples ability to express their distaste for autism more easily is the opposite of what censorship ought to aim to do.
    - 4y ago

psyc 4y ago

There was this popular kid in my senior year of high school. Class clown, well dressed, one of the star athletes. We'd been friends in 7th grade but he'd apparently forgotten and didn't talk to me. I was occasionally fodder for his loud jokes in front of the whole class, although the gay kid got it a lot worse than I did. One day I was fixing one of the computers in the office and he happened by. Nobody was around. He saw what I was doing and apropos of nothing he launched into something like, "You know, this place doesn't matter. Nothing here is real. Out there, a few years from now, you'll be in college, or working for fucking Microsoft or some shit. You know where I'll be? I'll be driving a forklift or changing somebody's oil if I'm lucky." No jokes. No smile.

ctime 4y ago
Well? Was he right? The suspense is terrible, I hope it lasts.
- psyc 4y ago
  I left it out because I struggled with how to say it and still don’t know the right way to tell it. I did become a software developer, and I did greatly enjoy my time at Microsoft. It wasn’t happily ever after, but at least it was happily until it wasn’t. He died 15 years later of a brain injury he sustained in a car accident that occurred around the same time we had that encounter. Just awful luck, having nothing to do with anything. I totaled my first car too, only difference was I didn’t hit my head the same way.
77pt77 4y ago
Except he is wrong. It is very real.