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Here's one: https://mashable.com/article/duckduckgo-search-engine-russian-disinformation https://mashable.com/article/duckduckgo-search-engine-russia...

grapeskin 4y ago
People complain about search engines like Google being full of garbage and fake info. DDG takes actions against that and people cry that it’s not fair. Are they supposed to just let governments astroturf their way to the top with propaganda?
- ummonk 4y ago
  They certainly shouldn’t be singling out one specific country’s astroturfing for down ranking.
  - kube-system 4y ago
    I agree, but a response to a topical issue is not necessarily evidence of that.
- deleted 4y ago
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- colordrops 4y ago
  One of the reasons I left google is precisely because they started downranking content for political reasons, just as DDG started doing.
  - throwmeariver1 4y ago
    Which search engine are you using now? I bet we will find them downranking for political reasons as well but I bet you are fine with their reasoning…
    - colordrops 4y ago
      We are talking in circles. If I'm gonna use an engine that downranks for political reasons then I might as well not use a shit one like DDG.
      - throwmeariver1 4y ago
        No you are avoiding a simple question with a nothing burger answer.
        colordrops 4y ago
        Google. It provides better results than DDG in many cases. The one case where DDG provided better results than Google was unfiltered news and opinion. That is no longer the case, so I'll use the shitty search engine which works a bit better for things like technical searches.
- kube-system 4y ago
  I think some people are under the impression that it’s possible to build a useful search engine that is completely algorithmic and unbiased. It’s just not possible, though. Any algorithm for which there is incentive to game, people will game. And legitimate sources often have no incentive to game the algorithms. There’s no one algorithm that will do everything perfectly. Eventually you’ll have some phishing scam, life-threatening suggestions, or illegal content popping up as a top result, and you’ll have to add manual exceptions.
  - TobyTheDog123 4y ago
    I think it all comes down to the type of curation being done and if the choices are made out of objectivity of subjectivity. Like prioritizing a legitimate website over a scam website isn't punishing the scam website because of a controversial opinion or the search engine operator didn't like the content, it's because the website is objectively a scam, it's easy to objectively identify it as such, and everyone agrees it's one. When it comes to Ukraine vs. Russia and propaganda, it is entirely impossible to have objectivity. As angry as this will make some people, opinions on the war in Ukraine are subjective. Russian outlets shouldn't be ranked lower than Ukrainian ones solely because a lot of people are on the side of Ukraine. I'm sure some Russian outlets are spreading objective falsehoods, and some Ukrainian outlets are spreading objective falsehoods. These individual outlets should be punished in search rankings, but to classify all Russian outlets as spreading misinformation and all Ukrainian outlets as objective truth completely demolishes the objectivity a lot of people want their search engines to have. It's a difficult topic, I feel like I talked in circles writing this comment.
    - grapeskin 4y ago
      I think people are running with the idea that DDG is only punishing Russians. Russian media also loves pushing this idea. I'm not convinced that DDG isn't downranking all junk. Russian disinfo spreaders and consumers just scream the hardest when their garbage is rightfully pushed aside. Same as the Q-worshipping crowd.
    - ppseafield 4y ago

grapeskin 4y ago

People complain about search engines like Google being full of garbage and fake info. DDG takes actions against that and people cry that it’s not fair. Are they supposed to just let governments astroturf their way to the top with propaganda?

ummonk 4y ago
They certainly shouldn’t be singling out one specific country’s astroturfing for down ranking.
- kube-system 4y ago
  I agree, but a response to a topical issue is not necessarily evidence of that.
deleted 4y ago
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deleted 4y ago
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colordrops 4y ago
One of the reasons I left google is precisely because they started downranking content for political reasons, just as DDG started doing.
- throwmeariver1 4y ago
  Which search engine are you using now? I bet we will find them downranking for political reasons as well but I bet you are fine with their reasoning…
  - colordrops 4y ago
    We are talking in circles. If I'm gonna use an engine that downranks for political reasons then I might as well not use a shit one like DDG.
    - throwmeariver1 4y ago
      No you are avoiding a simple question with a nothing burger answer.
      - colordrops 4y ago
        Google. It provides better results than DDG in many cases. The one case where DDG provided better results than Google was unfiltered news and opinion. That is no longer the case, so I'll use the shitty search engine which works a bit better for things like technical searches.
kube-system 4y ago
I think some people are under the impression that it’s possible to build a useful search engine that is completely algorithmic and unbiased. It’s just not possible, though. Any algorithm for which there is incentive to game, people will game. And legitimate sources often have no incentive to game the algorithms. There’s no one algorithm that will do everything perfectly. Eventually you’ll have some phishing scam, life-threatening suggestions, or illegal content popping up as a top result, and you’ll have to add manual exceptions.
- TobyTheDog123 4y ago
  I think it all comes down to the type of curation being done and if the choices are made out of objectivity of subjectivity. Like prioritizing a legitimate website over a scam website isn't punishing the scam website because of a controversial opinion or the search engine operator didn't like the content, it's because the website is objectively a scam, it's easy to objectively identify it as such, and everyone agrees it's one. When it comes to Ukraine vs. Russia and propaganda, it is entirely impossible to have objectivity. As angry as this will make some people, opinions on the war in Ukraine are subjective. Russian outlets shouldn't be ranked lower than Ukrainian ones solely because a lot of people are on the side of Ukraine. I'm sure some Russian outlets are spreading objective falsehoods, and some Ukrainian outlets are spreading objective falsehoods. These individual outlets should be punished in search rankings, but to classify all Russian outlets as spreading misinformation and all Ukrainian outlets as objective truth completely demolishes the objectivity a lot of people want their search engines to have. It's a difficult topic, I feel like I talked in circles writing this comment.
  - grapeskin 4y ago
    I think people are running with the idea that DDG is only punishing Russians. Russian media also loves pushing this idea. I'm not convinced that DDG isn't downranking all junk. Russian disinfo spreaders and consumers just scream the hardest when their garbage is rightfully pushed aside. Same as the Q-worshipping crowd.
  - ppseafield 4y ago