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It's gotta be a slow day on hacker news when this is at the top page. (Or, is this being upvoted because it is Cringely.) An entire article about web developme
by Spyro7 15y ago
It's gotta be a slow day on hacker news when this is at the top page. (Or, is this being upvoted because it is Cringely.)
An entire article about web development past, present, and future without a single mention of PHP....
All snark aside, I strongly disagree with several things in this article.
Java never left, so it can hardly arrive again. Anyone that has ever worked in a corporate environment problably knows what I am talking about. Java dominates the Enterprise landscape.
Disk speed limitations on database access times can be and has already been overcome by in-memory caching. This is not new. Advancing SSD tech will not suddenly lead to Java's total ascendance as a web development platform.
The characterization of dynamic languages as "easy to program for a broader, younger, and maybe less experienced crowd of developers" is a rather unfortunate blanket generalization. This is especially the case because most people that I know that use dynamic languages usually have some experience in things like Java, C, C++ that Cringlely seems to hold in high regard.
And finally:
http://www.paulgraham.com/avg.html http://www.paulgraham.com/avg.html
The real problem that the vast majority of web developers face is not trying to cope with overwhleming amounts of daily traffic. The real problem is how do you build a product that is compelling enough to get signups, and how do you continue to develop this product to attract new signups.
Java is fast, and that is lovely. However, speed of execution does not matter when your development speed drags. When you are developing a product, you need to be able to move fast. If you get substantial traffic, then you can always rewrite backend services in Java (or whatever floats your boat) at that time.
Edit: When I say Java, I refer to the language - just as Cringely does in this article.
Of course a number of excellent languages have developed that combine the advantages of the JVM with the benefits of a more powerful language. (My personal favorite being Clojure.)
- nupark2 15y agoHowever, speed of execution does not matter when your development speed drags. When you are developing a product, you need to be able to move fast. However, the JVM doesn't necessarily mean 'Java'. If you get free performance and more efficient development, there's no advantage to using a poorly architected inefficient runtime.
- angelbob 15y agoYou've pretty much nailed why JRuby catches on so well. It's still not fast for a JVM language, but it's blazing for Ruby - plus you can call through to Java where you need/want it.
- mattmanser 15y agoWhat's odd is that here in the UK it's C# dominating the enterprise landscape. Or at least that's the impression I've always got from the jobs mentioned to me and the developers I've met. I've met PHP, C#, Python, Rails devs but never a Java developer. The thing about .Net not being awesome compared to Java, it wasn't but that's not true any more, .Net is awesome compared to Java. There's a hell of a team behind the C# language at the moment and they're about 3-4 years ahead of Java in terms of new language features. Not that I've any delusions about .Net coming to dominate in the web space, but it's more likely than Java imo which looks old now when I read it, though admittedly I don't keep up on it that well.
- recoiledsnake 15y agoWhat you said is increasingly true in the US too, from what I have seen.
- jebblue 15y agoNot from what I've seen. There are tons of Java jobs. There's good reason for that. I can run Java apps on any OS. That's pretty important. It runs fast these days. Eclipse totally rocks and most if not all of what you need is totally free in the Eclipse world.
- antihero 15y agoDown here in Brighton a shitload of Python/Django is also happening, too :)
- jcromartie 15y agoC# is in demand, because C# developers are rarer. Also it's a more interesting language to work in and has features that attract smart developers. Java developers are abundant, and mostly employed in the dark corners of big enterprise software shops you've never heard of.
- rbanffy 15y agoI have seen some very dark corners reserved for C# programmers around Sharepoint deployments...
- radu_floricica 15y ago> Java is fast ... God, what a flashback. Seems like yesterday people were saying left and right that java has no chance because it's an interpreted language.